suggestion on anti-hacking

Actually, I only did want to talk about auto-ban. If you search up the posts regarding auto-bans and hackers on forums, there is plenty, just go and read a few and you will understand. If I wanted to make a petty complain about the GM, I would have just used the 9months unseen report instead. Also, I did not force the 2 GMs to defend themselves, as I specifically stated that it wasn't an attack. If they wanted to clear up some misunderstandings, by all means, go ahead. Maybe the culture you are taught to deliver a message is different from mine, I always believe that with credible sources makes a presentation/argument better.

I agree with you that the game I'm passionate about doesn't exist without them, and they're doing their best. But you must also understand that just because they give their best, doesn't mean it is enough. Needless to say, I'm still appreciative of what the staff(s) are doing.

Instead of arguing what my clearly indicated motives were, you might want to get back to the actual topic of this post and not drift away? Are you here to discuss the situation of the hacking and auto-ban system or are you here to teach people how to get their message across?

 

Speaking of the original post, The original post wasn't necessarily about the autobahn system. It was asking to reward players who actively report hackers.

How this got so off-topic is beyond me but pushing Kai or Muff or any other GM to confirm that they consider auto-ban as a high priority is pointless, this affects their time first and foremost as the GMs are the ones putting the time into replying and closing hundreds of threads a day. At this point in time, every feedback thread related to hackers ends up with the same conclusion, Hackers bad, Need auto-ban.

What we need to do is encourage the GMs to be more transparent and make the information available to everyone using for example the GM development blog. How is taking a jab at their forum posts will lead to transparency and them wanting to share more with us about the progress of their team... I'm not sure. Probably wasn't the best way to give them constructive feedback.

I have seen Becca refer to the staff as coworkers before. You wouldn't go to your superior or even a senior coworker and start slamming fists on his desk demanding him to hurry up with the project as this increases your own workload.

 

idk, it went from: staff has priorities > implement auto-ban to save staff time > redundant to reward players who report hackers since there is auto-ban.

Why is it considered pointless if I may ask? In the GM blog, they didn't mention anything about auto-ban. 2 of the players mentioned auto-ban, but 5 pages of discussion and nothing about auto-ban from the staff. If you do not think that this thread is the right place for me to ask, where do you think I should ask instead?

I agree with this.

Pretty much sums up every thread created in regards to hacking, auto-ban, and the economy.

If you don't mind sharing, how would you go about giving them constructive feedback?

If your manager assigned the department a top priority work to reduce workload for your department, 3 years 9months later and your senior coworker is not done with the top priority work. Idk if the desk is the only thing I'm slamming tbh.

I'm not saying that the person coding it is incompetent. It might be a lack of manpower for all I know. Just remember it is 3 years and 9 months.

 

I doubt that any GM would disagree that auto-ban is the highest priority, At this point, we are just asking confirmation from GMs that cannot disclose any information or simply lack the knowledge of the stages of development. With the promise of monthly updates in the GM blog, I think the auto-ban will be addressed eventually, perhaps not in as great detail as we would like, but that's just part of developing the "Anti-Cheat" mechanism after the community has already been established.
The best place for you to give feedback about the lack of transparency in the development of the auto-ban is probably the Feedback thread, Where we know for sure Matt would read it and perhaps even appreciate how passionate you are in regard to this matter.

Your first reply to the thread came across as quite emotional. I think that involving your own personal feelings on the topic of your reports might have been unrelated to the thread and auto-ban in general. Sometimes us being passionate about something can hinder the message you are trying to get across. Like I said, perhaps throwing jabs at GMs forum posts wasn't the best idea when what you claim to try and achieve is some form of update or transparency.

I think that it's easy to forget that we are talking about one person, one person who is invested in this project not out of economic gain but out of a passion. If you take my example literally then sure, in a company environment (depends on the industry) four years to complete one project is quite a long time. It's easy to forget things already achieved by the developer such as the Control Panel that as far as I am concerned works flawlessly. Just a year ago around winter, we didn't have 100-250 active hackers on the day to day bases, and we would be lucky to have 800 players online at peak time. So to say that the Anti-Cheat system was the top priority for three years and nine months is quite controversial but it's simply not true, because as the community changes and grows there would be changes to the priority of development. Our experience as players is valid but sometimes you must step out of your own perspective and see the bigger picture.

 

What you're doing is drunk driving, shouting out the window "I'm not trying to hit anyone" and claiming you didn't mean to hit that grandma with your car. It doesn't matter what you meant, it matters what you did. And what you did was unnecessarily call out two GMs. We don't need evidence to believe that the GMs took 3 days to respond to a report. If your culture taught you to cite your sources, then you likely had the education to know that you should be succinct and recognize context.

I also don't think what the GMs are doing is enough in terms of stopping hackers, and CS price inflation is proof of that, but if they're doing their best, there's nothing more to be said. You might be appreciative of what they're doing, but the result of what you're saying is making it more difficult for them to meet your sky high standards, and if you think that's a bold claim, look at any MS private server and I can tell you almost all of them have had at least one staff member drop out because of the kinds of things you're saying.

Even though I'm suspicious of your intentions, my focus is on how a 3 day response time being slow is stupid, and how your expectations are negatively impacting the GMs ability to do what all of us want: to create an autoban system and stop hackers. My message supports the GMs by letting them know that some people think expecting them to respond instantaneously at all times is insane, and I believe they need to hear that or they'll lose hope.

Since you're so keen on credible sources and screenshots, let me try to speak to you in a language you'll understand. Here's screenshot proof that the types of things you say can and will make it harder for GMs to do their job:



Now, let me try this again. The game you're passionate about doesn't exist without the GMs, and they're doing their best. They've already said multiple times they're going to implement one and are working on it. It doesn't matter what your intentions are, and I'm not teaching you how to how to get your message across. I don't care about you. I care about how the GMs are being affected by your words. The one thing that will make auto ban a reality is the staff, and your words and the result of those words are are demonstrably wasting the GM's time. Your 3 day response time expectation is insensitive to the work it takes to run a server, and I'm not going to waste any more of my time on this subject because if you still don't see how your words are affecting the GMs, nothing will convince you and I'll have to just hope that the GMs tolerance levels aren't so worn down from the negative comments like yours they've endured over the years that it affects their work.

 

Your point is the GM's are not answering your reports at the speed you expect them to, which is highly suggested to be within 24 hours. You even show a screenshot of you nagging the GM's to answer the report, so you obviously have a problem with the turn around time, including emphasizing the amount of time the hacker was left alone. Regarding your 9 month report, is that hacker still around?

My comment is solely about how players like you have this entitlement issue that you believe your report should not only be prioritized but handled as quickly as possible as if the hacker is literally breaking the game. I literally came across an issue when a GM left open a Zakum JQ map and utlizied every avenue I could to bring it to their attention as you did get multiple rewards. It was solved hours later, but my expectation wasn't immediate, I however put more priority on it since it was a powerful exploit for free items. File the report and move on, that's at most your responsibility as a player.

Lastly I trust staff to implement an autoban system when they feel comfortable using it, having false bans as another factor Gm's would have to deal with in a manual report format is a considerable extra workload as every person will appeal it, legit or not.

 

Wrong, my point is if staff have other priorities, auto-ban should be a priority to save staff time, and therefore, we do not need to reward players for reporting hackers. Which was already confirmed by staff in the following post that it is soonTM.

The screenshot was to add context to the situation. The emphasizing of the time was to showcase how urgent auto-ban is needed.

Since this is brought up again, I want to clarify that I did mention that a 9months report wasn't attended to, but I did not say that it was hackers. It was actually for soliciting RWT. Since taking a SS of the post will be too unnecessary, the context was basically people trading teleport rocks for a selfie. So to answer your question, he/she is not a hacker. Like what you said, I'm not the police and I moved on and didn't bother about it till 9months later, there wasn't any reply still.

Another real report example, somebody wanted to trade 3months of twitch subscription ($) for 300m in-game. 5 days ago I reported him and still no response. Is it game-breaking? Not really. Am I desperate to get that guy banned? Not really. It simply isn't just as game-breaking as the hackers.

Do you think that I want a response in 24hours? Yes and no. If it isn't urgent and literally game-breaking, it is whatever. However, if it is game-breaking, I obviously want a response ASAP. However, it seems like my approach came off as being too emotional.

Not per se literally breaking the game, but they are breaking the game. Maybe it doesn't mean much for those who chill/afk in the game, but for those that actually play the game, they will understand that it is actually breaking the game. In that report post alone, I reported 9 hackers in 2 maps out of 40 channels. And mind you, this is only 2 maps in the game.

Yes, it is a powerful exploit for free items. That is exactly what the hackers are doing.

That is exactly what I did for the 9months unseen attempted RWT report. It wasn't game-breaking urgent, so I had no issues with that. However, the hacking issue is game-breaking in my eyes and hence the urgency.

I agree with you, nobody wants to get falsely banned.

 

...Yes by emphasizing how the turn around time on these reports isn't to your standard(s).

Then why bring up an issue with a report not being followed up within 9 months, especially one that wouldn't be handled by an auto ban? If your argument had merit you would be able to provide more examples relevant to how auto-ban could have handle it. Just seems very dishonest to try to emphasize your point with something completely irrelevant to the discussion, and make no mistake, it is.

I mean you're trying to say that players quit over a botter not being banned within a 3 day time period. It feels like you're trying to appeal to emotion while trying to mask the fact you're pandering.

There are consequences to their existence, no one is minimizing that point. What is being minimized is your attitude that GM's aren't being responsive enough and therefore we need a auto-ban system to make their lives easier. When not even taking into consideration that even with one false ban would mean any person subjected to it suddenly has the opportunity to question it. I understand you said you don't want false bans and expect there to be none, but the relationship between a game like this and an autoban system will not necessarily lead to less work. Auto-ban means more effective banning of bots, but it also means more appeals which the GM's would have to review, appeals that majority have to be answered by one person since he has log access that none of the GM's do not.

Also, not sure what you mean by the whole "oNlY plAyErS kNoW", by 135 you're doing boss rotations with minimal grinding unless you're a mage in which case you have like, 5-7 prominent maps to choose from and I don't believe those ones have botting problems, maybe wolf spiders?

The issue most people are presenting to you is not an autoban system won't help, it's just a shallow solution that doesn't silver bullet the problems, it's the fact you're saying we need it because the GM's aren't immediately responding to you and therefore an autoban system is needed.

 

Because like I said, if my intention of the reply was to attack the GMs, then I would have used the 9months report to prove my point on how slow the response is. But in this case, I did not use it because that wasn't my intention. Sometimes I wonder if you actually read. I brought it up as a comparison and it wasn't meant to attack anyone. Why did I bring it up you ask? To elaborate my point that if the rule-breaker is not doing a game-breaking act, then it really isn't that big of a rush to get them banned.

This statement literally told me you don't understand anything. It wasn't a botter, it was 9 botters in 2 maps. And mind you, I only checked 2 maps out of the god knows how many maps they hack in.

nOt sUrE what the point of typing like that does, but ok. Do you think people in this game progress by bossing? I dare say at least half of the veterans in this game progress by playing their mages actively. Have you thought to yourself why are there such a minority of players farming for etcs or scrolls? Why is almost everyone just leeching/ulu/stoppers/apq? Those that farm their etcs/scrolls legitly just get undercut by those hackers, which hack and farm on multi clients with 0 effort.


Anyway, I'm done having this pointless bickering with you.

 

No one is saying you're attacking the GM's, people are saying you're being petty based on your unreasonable standard without any context of their workload, or research that is required. Autoban has nothing to do with RWT and would not be capable of such a thing, you know it, I know it, so you irresponsibility tried to use that information to your advantage.

Name me some names of people who quit over your singular report over these 9 botters that you feel were not taken care of in the time you believe they should have been. Now I want you to tell me how many characters the GM's have banned from that date, to the date they got it done. If you're complaining about turn around time, you obviously have access to this data, so by all means provide it.

Common usage of a meme to mock the idiotic thing you're saying.

Because those things are more profitable as they have infinitely more utility? I mean look what you just listed, leeching=leveling; ulu=great drops/easy to kill; stoppers/apples=used for bosses? I mean they have the highest demand. I have guildmates who do farm etc, mainly for HP/HT quests and still make a decent wage.

This was a perfectly healthy discussion before you attempted to insult me, you took a very juvenile approach after being slightly criticized for being over zealous and using a very dishonest example.

EDIT: I'd also save some face and keep true to your word and just leave it at that.

 

Just wondering, shouldn't a report command in the server be easy to make and will make eeport more often? Also, having GMs from different time zones should be a priority in order to have most times of the day covered answering to reports and wouldnt net them stack or let hacker have their way for too long before being removed.

As a returning player, I am not too aware about whether anything is being done differently today, and I do not wish it to be avilable to the public as such knowledge can be used to ban evade.