Imagine the MapleRoyals staff were running your country..

Not sure if this was a troll thread but you do realize that the admins and GMs have discretion to just ban people as they see fit, right?

Although I have to say that I do not agree with the whole 'guilty until proven innocent' concept that seems to apply to most bans, I can see why they do it and I accept it as it is because at the end of the day, it's a private server and this gives the admins so much leeway to do things their way. It's just a matter of accepting things as they are.

And again, I really hope that you can see that the admins and GMs tend to ban people as a precautionary measure - that's what ban appeals are for. Better to be safe than sorry, no? It's their server that's at stake if something goes wrong so you can't really blame them for banning people who even show the slightest intention of breaking the rules.

Obviously, we can tell that some things are meant in a joking context and the admins and GMs are not idiots or incompetent people - they know it too. Those people who were banned for 'RWT' because of TP rock jokes etc can always appeal their cases. Nobody said that they can't appeal their cases so what's the issue here? I know I definitely wouldn't be too happy if I were to be banned over a small joke about RWT but then again, those people who were making those jokes probably also knew that RWT is heavily frowned upon in this server so making those jokes is just them being very ignorant and/or irresponsible to begin with. You'll see them crying about it later on when they get banned and start to blame the admins and GMs for their ban when it was their fault to begin with.

 

Why should they? Nobody has given me a good reason as to why people should be banned for obvious jokes. Please explain.

And what changes did they make exactly? Did you even see the thread? He literally got banned for saying "ima stop hacking now Tim DDD". How is that "making changes"? Ban appeals are literally a direct representation of what people get banned for in game.

And uhhh..he's a friend? I know him? Also that's such a terrible argument. Maybe people shouldn't get upset over war crimes in other countries irl because it's not happening to them? <- Obvious hyperbole before someone comes saying I'm completely out of touch with reality.

 

I may not be a GM but at this point its mostly semantics. Staff discretion really, since most things are discussed among all staff. No matter if youre a GM, an Admin, gert, a forum mod, intern, or whatever Joel is which at this point is way more than graphic designer lol.

Also treating all jokes seriously means hackers wont just say "it was a joke". And youd be surprised how many legit hackers flaunt enough to be on the same level as joking.

 

What about this even remotely screams "troll thread"? This legit happened and I legitimately think that those are stupid rules.

The fact that this is a private server and the GMs/admins can ban whoever they like is completely beside the point. If a private business owner decided to not allow people from a certain race to enter their shop I would 100% support their right to do that. Does that mean it isn't completely stupid? No. I support their right to do it, but it still doesn't mean I agree with it. I posted this thread because maybe one of the admins will see it and be like "wow......that does sound pretty stupid! Maybe I should change the rules!" Banning people as a precautionary measure is also completely different from banning people immediately for making obvious jokes. If it's a precautionary measure, they can go ahead and check whether that person actually RWTed or hacked. They have logs and access to every single microtransaction you could ever imagine. After finding out that they didn't hack, they could unban them within literally minutes or hours.

Also, being able to appeal cases does not change the fact that rule itself is stupid. In real life (at least in any decently modern/progressive country) there are rarely ever any absolutes. You don't arrest people for every single joke they make. There's some common sense used and usually a reasonable process that's followed.

Finally, not everyone knows how serious these types of jokes are in this server, so banning everyone for it even if it's just for "30 days" is stupid. If anything, implement a strike system.

 

With the amount and type of logs the admins have access to in this game, being able to tell whether someone was actually hacking or not should be pretty simple. If not, they should investigate instead of blindly banning and waiting for someone to post a ban appeal before even looking at what happened.

 

They do.

That doesnt mean hackers wont use it as an excuse. Its time intensive to keep knocking down each excuse and treating all jokes the same makes that easier, and opens the door for reduced bans for legit jokes as opposed to hackers who stay perm banned. If that makes sense.

Not sure whats going on with the case in question however, im on my phone but last i checked its still open.

 

I'm pretty sure there's enough context to tell that "ima stop hacking now Tim DDD" after Tim put a notice out asking if there were any hackers online is obviously a joke. I understand that sometimes it's hard to tell but many people have gotten banned for painfully obvious jokes.

I highly doubt people would get unbanned if they didn't post ban appeals. Just because treating every joke the same makes things easier doesn't mean it's right. Again, this is HIGHLY hyperbolized, but imagine you threw everyone who said "I'ma kill you" to their friends as a joke in prison and then investigated afterwards? Oh and after you found out they were innocent you let them out 30 days later? It's still stupid to me. Also, for the admins this server is literally their job. They get paid insane amounts of money to host this game. If they're gonna ban everyone blindly for making the smallest joke they could at least put in the effort to check whether they're actually hacking or RWTed and unban them immediately (not 30 days later).

 

my mans timk out here can't even afford a zakum model with his insane admin salary

 

Well....someone is definitely making money hosting this server. Whether it's Tim/Matt or whoever.

 

Of course people dont get unbanned if the dont appeal? The whole point is if you think youre innocent you appeal, if you dont its sort of agreed you accept you broke the rules? Lol

 

Because when enforcing the rules people who go out of their way to break them can use the fact that they are "Joking" to get away with "Murder".

And you are right, We all should care how the GMs handle the ban appeals and we should insist that they apply the rules to everyone equally without giving anyone special treatment. I think they did just that so far.

I feel somewhat optimistic about the results of your friend's appeal. I think you are a great friend for trying to bring it to the community's attention to what you think is injustice. Just make sure you don't end up doing more harm than good

 

What you are seeking is Democracy in a private server. This isn't one. Just accept the reality and move on. Everything on this thread have been already discussed in the past thanks to similar people of your kind.

 

So....I guess just execute everyone who say's they're a serial murderer because screw checking if they actually did anything?

With the amount of logs the GMs have and the level of detail those logs contain, they can pretty simply tell whether someone was actually hacking or RWTed. I also don't think I did anything wrong aside from criticizing the rules/some people here. I don't plan on doing much more than that so..yeah lol.

So...reasonable people? lol'd

Whether they keep their current rules or not doesn't really affect me any more than it just slightly ticking me off because of how stupid I think it is. I know this thread isn't gonna change anything...but I figured why not.

 

You lack a fundamental understanding of how law enforcement works.

When we ban someone, it's equivalent to arresting someone, not execution. You can't turn around from an execution if youre innocent, you can from an arrest.

People get arrested when they either admit to a crime (like here) or we have evidence they broke a law (someone recorded them hacking, etc). Sometimes it's both.

 

If we're going to talk about equating the game to a country, the economy of this so-called country is being attacked by smugglers and money launderers. It only makes sense that the legislature would come up with some sort of law to combat these issues. Then, the duty falls on the law enforcement officers who will carry out their duties to their country by arresting those whom they believe to be breaking the law or have in fact broken the law.

As for arresting without charge, police officers have the power to arrest and detain individuals for terrorism based upon reasonable suspicion only and without a warrant. The detainees may be held for an extended period of time, provided that the court grants an extension. This is for the police to build a case against the certain individual. Taking this into the MapleRoyals context, don't you think that people who RWT and hack are as dangerous to the game as terrorists to a country? Thus, banning people in the game as a precaution while they prove their innocence or show the admins and GMs that they do not have a case against them seems like a reasonable thing to do.

You also see the judiciary also passing severe punishments on people for what seem to be minor offences or at least offences that do not really justify having such harsh punishments - not because they deserve it but to make an example of them. This completely justifies the admins and GMs passing harsh punishments on people for something that may be construed as a joke and maybe even borderline RWT because this shows the public that RWT is strictly forbidden and any slight indication of intention to partake in it is punishable.

I believe that this whole real world system also applies to this server and if anything, the only setback is that the admins seem to have all the power instead of there being some sort of check and balance of powers as per the real world but then, we need to remind ourselves that this is simply a game. There's really no need to get your panties up in a bunch just because you see some people crying over bans. The admins and GMs are not unreasonable people at all, they're just doing what it takes to preserve the server.

 

That's not what you said and that's not what my point was, please don't straw man me. You said "if you dont [appeal] its sort of agreed you accept you broke the rules". My point was that the act of not appealing does not imply guilt. Obviously there's a difference between executing people and "arresting them." But in either case, you don't arrest someone for 30 days for making an obvious joke. You're missing the main point: you don't arrest/kill/execute anyone for making obvious jokes. And if you do, you make sure they're let out/revived/resurrected immediately after you find out they're not guilty.

My above response pretty much answers this.

 

The appeal is a trial, you can opt to not have a trial and plea out or just accept sentencing (rare, just like people who don't appeal- nearly everyone appeals even the people who VERY blatantly hack in our faces), but it does happen.

And it doesn't imply innocence either. If you are innocent, appeal- if you don't appeal what are we supposed to assume? Well, it's easier (and better) to just keep people banned till they do so people don't hack, not appeal, and just keep hacking when unbanned. Sort of like cops will keep questioning till you ask for a lawyer.

and again, if you joke about killing someone and people report it you'll get arrested- it's sort of beyond our control- the dude smega'd it to the whole world. What is he expecting? lol. It's not like you're in guild chat and someone pulls 3 WS from gach and says "lul hacks".

edit: you also can't compare ban length to arrest length. This is a videogame, it's not going to be comparable at all.