Right now archers are the squishiest classes in the game, having low hp, no defensive skills and mediocre avoid In addition they don't really have high DPS to compensate for it, and they gain less HP per wash than NLs I'd suggest making the skills bow expert/marksman boost give a passive HP bonus every level. For example you can have them give you 70 HP every level, for a total of 2100 HP at max (maybe you can give MMs more HP like 3k or 4k cause they are kinda weak) This will make archers less squishy and compensate for the low hp gains they get when washing, and even people who already washed can still use the extra HP to tank stronger bosses like toad. Archers are supposed to be more of a beginner friendly class (cause they don't need good gear to join bosses) and making the washing easier will greatly help new players. Also there are almost no archers who washed to 30k so not many people will be hurt by this, and it won't encourage SE mules that much cause you'd need to be around lvl 140 to max both SE and bow expert and you'd already leech bosses at this lvl. Moderator edit: Kind of implemented indirectly through new ways to get HP. Moving to Accepted for sake of closure. Please make a new thread if you are still not satisfied!
i would personally like archers a much higher base HP and a slower hp gain rate than what it currently is at, with the same total HP attained by lvl 200 (or whatever that is balanced) this would allow archer players to have more survivability in the early game, to match with their peers (warriors have high base hp and gain rates, thieves have avoid, mages have magic guard, pirates have a mix of avoid and hp), and allow them to have an early start to the 4th job as a support class/off dps - making a new archer player an asset to a party without the worry of death. the lowered hp gain rates is to discourage the building of SE mules, making it extremely costly (somewhat like a soft punishment) for a mule game.
Actually I think the opposite of this could be useful, you could keep the base HP the same but increase the HP gained per level after lvl 120 from 22 on average to something like 50. In the early game high HP isn't useful because stuff like zak and krex hit low damage (and at 120-135 most people leech anyway), it's only at like lvl 160+ when washing becomes really important with stuff like toad, HT, neo tokyo, shaolin and other high level bosses that hit high damage. This will also discourage SE mules since you'll need to get to a high level to get high HP, and nobody will make a level 180 SE mule or something Also pirates do not have high avoid, buccs have decent HP and iframes while sairs are even more squishy than archers with extremely low avoid. However, sairs also have extremely high DPS which makes them have sort of a glass cannon role. Archers on the other hand are both squishy and also quite weak in terms of DPS
if archers were to gain a skill like warriors to gain extra hp per AP added after 120, there will be an extreme incentive to make a mule, as they will be extremely cheap to make if its purely hp gained from levelling is increased to 50, while AP washed into hp stays the same, then its more or less business as always - the 30 extra hp might be too small of a margin to justify, when the same can be earned by using 2 more APR, and mules are not attackers, so a base int of 300~400 is not unreasonable. increasing the base hp on the other hand (via bow expert, job changes, etc.), while lowering the HP gained per AP will make low level mules extremely costly to make, as the APR required increases to painful levels. so what about washing for HT, shaolin and neo tokyo? HT - as the server intended, no HP washing is required to play the end game contents, having the required HP at a lower level is a luxury shaolin - the content was targeted for warriors, much like the boss having 120 avoid makes it impossible for warriors to participate as attackers (except for the madlads with some weird 200++ dex, maple pops and pyrope weapons) neo tokyo - content was on the edge of big bang and had hp washing elements getting promoted, probably need more adjustments?
No, you (or whichever Staff member) are in the wrong putting this in the Accepted sub-forum. The idea suggested in the OP is totally different from a general implementation of new ways of getting HP. Please put this back into the general feedback section as it has not been truly accepted or denied unless the Staff is considering adding HP to bow expert/mm boost.
Have notified the Staff in question regarding the above Edit: have spoken to the Staff, and will be shifting this thread back to the General Feedback section
Hi Ayane, as this suggestion was made in March, would like to confirm with you is your proposed suggestion still 70 HP per level (max of 2100 HP) for the passive HP bonus of Bow Expert/Marksman Boost
If you increase archer HP, I suggest you simply just increase it by a lot more to have your tanky SE mules already. How does it make sense, that an archer could be able to easily tank toad? Like for real, I do not see how this would not seal archers' fate as SE mules, I mean come on, increasing the HP on a ranged support class? How will this even do anything else than exactly buffing SE mules? I probably see this completely wrong but it just sounds completely counterproductive to me, unless the goal is indeed buffing SE mules.
I would prefer any additional HP changes to archers to require some time investment and a high level requirement to prohibit characters made just to be SE mules from accessing it. Perhaps Athena Pierce could offer an offensively tedious bowman-locked 160+ level-restricted HP quest line, like Mar's Chalice, that utilizes unique untradeable drops, like the daily HP quest -- so one can't buy or mage-farm their way through it. The tediousness should somewhat reflect the washing investment this suggestion would negate. 160+ because zak/krex/pap are perfectly accessible to unwashed archers at 135. This solution would increase HP specifically for players committed to raising their archers to high levels, would not require edits to skills, and would require effort and time by the player to achieve any increases in their HP. Providing a big boost of hp through a skill change without work from the player may be perceived as unfair to those who pursued the master collector medal for the hp or did the daily repeatable hp quest for days on end -- or washed.
Buff bm/mm dmg, not their hp. As of now, mm(meme! jk, sry bad joke) is the lowest dps attacker class and bm is just slightly above hero, which is kinda sad as they're supposed to be single target specialist class. I feel that if they were on par with bucc in terms of single target dps, people would be more willing to play them as a main character, rather than just a mule. The issue right now is that people would rather bring SE mule than to take a SE attacker due to their lack of damage, not hp. I honestly don't see how buffing archer's hp would change the SE muling meta. References for damage comparison https://royals.ms/forum/threads/4th-job-skill-changes.135025/ https://royals.ms/forum/threads/drk-joins-the-battle-again-post-patch-drk-buff.176195/
HP washing shouldn't be a thing. It kills the game. Every class should be able to fight every boss and enjoy the content. There is no nostalgic experience. Meta dictates we make a new character with 150+int and buy leech all the way to 130+. No PQ's or actually playing the game, grinding together. Leeching is LAME, it shouldn't be a thing. It's sad when you see a person actually playing the game, grinding on mobs. You think to yourself. Wow they've f***** their character up. They're going to have to remake that or else they wont be able to do any end game content.
No reason it has to be one or the other! A route to give my unwashed bowman 1500 extra hp would be a real boon and allow it to do scar/tank krex eye/ht without being reliant on hyper body. Bigfoot and shao would still be out of reach. So while these proposed changes may not directly address the se mule meta, there do exist archer players like myself that would benefit from an additional hp source.
They've already implemented 1. daily hp quest 2. hp buff to legendary medal 3. dojo belts 4. a one-time 500 hp quest 5. hp scrolls for pet equips Bigfoot, shao, toad and samurai are probably stil not doable even with these, but sairs & nl share the same burden. So what's to stop sairs and nls from asking for hp buffs as well if archers are gonna get hp buffed? *sairs have lower avoid and similar hp gain, and cost slightly more to wash when compared to archers*
Agree with this. They added a HP quest not long ago that you can re-do forever, afaik. The 500hp quest from Ellinia + general washing if needed. Asking for more HP for Archers is a slippery slope, as more people are bound to do so too sooner than later "but archers got it". And before you know it, Royals is official MS and we all have 30k hp and do 30mil dmg Either don't do anything or give them similar HP as NL, they shouldn't get exclusive skill buffs imo
Maybe make a high level archer exclusive quest (something like lvl 170 or so) that gives 2k HP and isn't that difficult to complete (maybe same difficulty like the water of the spring of life, but not endless like that daily hp quest that only gives 10 hp). You can call it something like physical training, the archers used their strength training from wielding a bow to grow bigger muscles and become more tough lol. It's kinda realistic too Right now NLs are a lot easier to wash than BMs so it would be fair if archers get more HP so they become equal (and aside from that NLs are better than BMs in a lot of things). Sairs might also get a bit more HP but less than archers (maybe 500 HP or so). Also I think archers need a damage buff too (mostly MMs), you can remove that 5 atk buff MMs got and give them added crit chance instead, something like +15% crit chance at max level. MM is supposed to be some accurate sniper and it doesn't make sense NLs have higher crit chance than them
I’m certainly not stopping sair or NL mains from making their own feedback threads about additional routes to increase their hp. If there were analogous quests lines for other classes like the one I described in an earlier post at 160+, I wouldn’t have issues with it. They would have to be appropriately balanced, though, given the differences in washing efficiency and cost between classes. My posts in this thread are meant to simply share my experience and HP situation as an unwashed archer, and state my feedback that an additional route to get more hp at high levels would be a great improvement to my game experience.
