Before you make this mistake…

First of all let me start with this disclaimer.- I do not believe in “If you’re not with me, you’re against me”, I will agree with some reasonement behind the latest changes, but that does not mean I will agree with wich were and how these changes were implemented, also im not addressing those changes directly, I just will use them as examples to make a point.


Ok, that being said, let’s talk about this.-

It has come to me that some staff members were unaware that achiles “tanked” the deadly attacks commonly refered as “1/1”, and now make a change just like they did with Meso guard and magic guard its being considered, and this is not only a bad idea, it has not even a reason to be considered in the 1st place.

So, what were the reasons to make these changes? In my eyes there can only be 3:

1.-Increase the challenging aspect of the game.- It has been mentioned that this skill was meant to work this way all the time….despite back then achiles/mg/MG tanked it just like royals used to, but its been mentioned aswell that, these skills tanked just bcs of a bug…..Even without mention the obvious “its not gonna affect all jobs the same”, also some staff member mentioned that the main reason to do these changes are the following 2….

2.-Disencourage the use of mules.- In this case make sed mules less reliable. Let me repeat my original statement, despite I can see a clear argument behind the changes I AM NOT SAYING THE CHANGES WERE GOOD OR FAIR(not saying the opposite either here, theres some othe threads to discuss that) but out of these 3 skills both meso and magic guard , gave a very reliable protection to their users job, making them safe sed targets, without the assistance of an active bish, if their amount of HP was good enough, the only way to a shadower to die as sed target is by user mistake, aside that, there was no real danger.

Now that shad/bish sed targets are nerfed, warriors are the best… right? Lemme remind you something.. Meso guard tank 50% of the dmg….even with no high avoid/shifter, they’re pretty safe just by this skill(b4 the nerf I mean) magic guard takes 80% of the dmg and transforms it into MP reduction..Achiles is…..15%(20% for drks, but drk safe sed target KEKW) so long story short, if you main purpose is to disable AFK sed mules….. WARRIORS ARE NOT AFK SED TARGETS.

3.- Increase the relevance of Bishop role in bosses.- Its really, REALLY ARGUABLY that bishs are not relevant at all in boss scenes aside be a heal/hs/hsh mule, mainly on HT where, the popular joke of “ its not a NL Main+bish mule, its actually a bish main+dps mule” it’s an actual reality to me( common, if both chars are washed, equipped, but you only care of spam TT on the nl , when the bish role is actually interactive, wich one is the actual mule?), but sticking to the point, any person that has used a war as sed target, being active or a mule knows that, if you want to keep them alive a bish assistance is needed(or pray for no 1/1).

-In general terms…imagine how would it be?.- Do warrior users remember dying at lvl135-140 at zak due 0 points in achiles? Even being an almost braindead boss?, imagine that in HT. If you have played a warr and a ranged char you will notice the difference in frequency between hits in these roles… being killed by any mob touch(that u would be facing pretty much all the time) witouth shifter, avoid or iframes would be an insta kill if u distract for a sec, and can’t be compared to other melee clases such as buccs or shads for the reasons mentioned above. Having a bish assistance? What about sed target? If there’s a war beside the sed target in an HT run u gonna need 2 bishops watching them?, heal them just enough to keep them alive but not too much to surpass zerk range on drks?

Making this change will change nothing for good, and will only nerf Jobs that are already in a weird position even with the recent buffs, the only reason to make this change is to keep what its been said in the 73.3 patch notes “ we want Deadly Attacks (“1/1”) to affect all classes the same.”,

Funny thing is that…already does affect the same…So the final message of a change like this would be “weve fk them, FK YOU TOO”

 

first step, make bs main users in ht quit
2nd, make shadowers quit
3rd , about to make warriors quit LOL

on a serious note, if achilles would change they should first fix the dam bug that pet doesnt heal in preheads, THEN we talk

 

I'm just going to give a brief opinion on it:

I have a 156 bishop and I have a 191 shadower. I do not have any warriors. Overall I like the meso guard change. Made HT to a slight challenge over brain dead end game boss. I've not died once since the change either and I actively boss. I don't think we have to think of every situation between jobs as well mages got "nerfed" so shads and warriors should be also! I like the magic guard and meso guard change IN MY OPINION and in my opinion I don't think Achilles should be changed. Warriors are a tank class and as such should have some benefit over others and I think Achilles isn't too op anyways.

Anywho the shad who quit over the change were weak minded anyways as we are still ridiculously good at survivability

 

Is this the infinity bug or another one? Could you please elaborate? Thanks!

 

I have no idea what an infinity bug is but i am refering to the bug that pet doesnt heal when players stand close to HT heads

 

Pet autopot just tends to fail a lot in preheads for everyone, even mules that are just standing there. Doesn’t happen all the time though.

 

There is a bug with some bosses' 1/1 that causes pets to not use Auto HP. I presume this is what is being referred to! Forgive me if I'm mistaken. We've fixed that one for the next patch, anyway: https://royals.ms/forum/threads/meso-guard-bug.194984/

 

There's a bug where you stand in melee range of the pre-heads in HT (pre-heads = the fight before the battle music kicks in) where the pet will not auto heal you. I've seen many melee classes die because of this. You can avoid this spot by being far enough away from it or by standing on a pixel perfect spot close enough to the boss

 

first of all, Achilles is a luxury skill, like rush20/30. its maxed much later in 4th. i personally think it should remain intact the way it works, both because of Achilles being a luxury and lower priority skill, and because it could come in to play in later bosses somehow, and it could be reserved until then.

then again, im not against 1/1 ignoring Achilles, as long as all bosses have easily telegraphed 1/1 attacks like zakum.

as for shads, the problem isn't that they go to 1hp, its that they can get stuck in DS with 1hp, or stun/seduce with 1hp in ds, where they can't use HW. ive suggested 1/1 either dispelling ds as a change, or making it simpler to exit ds, such as, able to press other buttons to exit ds besides reg att, manual right click, and assassinate--which very likely isn't possible because your mp is at 1, or because you're seduced

• able to use HW in DS (exits DS and uses will, like nate)
• able to press shifter, reg att, nate, or HW in ds to exit DS any time, even w/o MP, but obviously won't cast those skills w/o MP, just other key options to exit out of DS comfortably in these situations
• able to press all these things if in DS and stunned as well
• able to will out of stuns

other suggestions would to be slightly lower the CD of HW at max, or raise the levels of will by a few levels, and provide greater qol/will aspects if you sacrifice the SP, like some of the suggestions in this thread

 

Erm, maybe i wasnt clear enough, or you didnt got my point, let me see if i can be a bit more clear.

I will avoid the topic of priority of achiles bcs it would derrail the point a bit, just gonna say that, its fine if you dont see it as relevant on 1st instance, but luxury its not the word i would use, anyway.....

-Like I stated i am not adressing Meso guard change in depth, even more, i dont want to adress it at all, so most of your suggestions dont actually belong here, theres a dedicated thread to do that, so please, post your ideas there...even more, if you see above, you will noticed this is created on "general discussion" and not on "feedback" since, i will not give a feeedback to something that has not be implemented yet....
Last, im aware that the real problem is not actually reducing the HP to 1 on shads, i mention both of those changes because the idea of 1/1 ignore achiles comes from an idea of "equality" to everyone of this mechanic. Also these changes were not implemented to make the game more engaging(at least we all know this wasnt the first priority) they were done to atack muling on bosses, in these cases SED mules and to promote bish active healing role, the "problem" they caused to actual shadowers, was a colateral issue( i agree that it could be worked somehow, but wasnt a quit job lvl colateral consecuence) so, why change this on warriors thjat are not causing a sed mule meta or dispromoting active bishops at all?, JUST to give every job the same treatment, wich is gonna be a false equility due to, if 1/1 actually does full effect to warriors aswell, being always close to the boss with no avoid or iframes due atacks like demo/bstep or distance like ranged or the fact that youre not permanently casting an atack skill like mages, will give warriors the higher death rate due this, by far. That will not leave warrs unplayable, but the cosntant deaths from ppl that are not as good playing or multiclienting will create a rage storm similar to the one when the avoid nerf was released.....Even changed inmeditely after, that hitted the server... why would we risk to rage the comunity with an unnecesary change?

 

ok no i am unclear what exactly you're trying to say, or what anyone else is supposed to say then.
im fine whatever staff ends up deciding, it seems likely that Achilles will not ignore 1/1s simply by virtue of skill/attentiveness and luxury of skill everywhere else with the exemption of deadly attacks, which require attention.

every day folks complain about the game being mindless/ez shroom game, but fly off and quit when staff attempts to increase the difficulty and curb muling/MC, which a good contingent of folks are not in favor of.

pretty sure warriors without Achilles arent the highest death rate by far, so why would they be after this change. i dont give a shit about catering to multiclient/mule culture, that is my personal general pov on this topic, excuse any unnecessary "feedback" i may have casually contributed here

 

I would like to hope people are not complaining about the game being too easily considering that this is classic Maplestory. I would like the staff to not nerf Achilles but if the staff feels like it's something that has to be done then so be it.

I would also like to add that it won't be easy to "fix" muling. That would require some massive changes such as opening a new server kind of massive. Muling is apart of this server, it is what it is.

 

Would like to ask what about Infinity bug fix? Been bugged for a while now.
Thanks!