Hey everyone , I've been around about half a year now and currently main a NL as I did back in GMS and it is all good fun! I gotta be honest and say it was pretty dissapointing that the class got a huge nerf on the server in comparison to how it was originally designed. Anyway, I guess players who are still playing a NL such a myself have to come to terms with that. I do however have 2 suggestions of which I think are more of a 'quality of life' boost than anything else. Shadow Stars and Avenger. Shadow Stars This skill might be underrated in how useful/important it is for a NL. It saves a lot of recharging (which can be expensive/inconvenient) and allows to get around with fewer sets (saves money/inventory space). Since doing a lot of HT however, I've noticed how annoying and inefficient dispel is for Shadow Stars. Especially if you get double dispelled (which happens pretty frequently actually). Since it requires you to rebuff.. 1. You lose 200 stars and get very little (and if double dispel, nothing) in return. Totally goes against what the skill is desgined for.. i.e. saving stars (and money for recharging in royals 500k/per set) 2. More often than not you attack 1-2 more times when being dispelled. This "breaks" the set, meaning Shadow Stars will be unable to take 200 from an existing set and move onto the next. My proposal/tldr: much like Advanced Combo and Transformation make Shadow Stars not being cancelled by dispel. It kind of defeats the purpose of the skill and is inefficient in both time, money and overall convenience. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Avenger NL's are known and sought after for their high single target DPS and therefore a medicore if not just total trash AoE skill maybe has its place. Accepting the fact that you will never be able to participate on powerleveling in LHC or even grinding in general at higher level is okay. However I do think Avenger could use a slight boost in damage %. Not to compete with any other class, but just to add a little more quality of life for single playing sake. For example when doing the daily hp quest, hunting mob cards, doing prequests (especially NT) or even at Ephenia's summons.. Like 90% of the time I still use TT over Avenger because if you're not hitting 6 monsters, it's simply not worth it to use Avenger. The damage is so so trash compared to TT. It just takes away the whole utility of an AoE attacking skill. My proposal/tldr: slighty increase damage % on Avenger to improve single playing a bit. The skill is pretty much usless unless it involves killing lower level mobs. Both of these changes will change nothing in regard to a NL's place in the bigger picture in my opinion.
Even though I agree with you more than a 100% I doubt the mega nerf to avoidability, alchemist, shadow shifter, (am I missing something?) will ever be reversed.
Please buff Avenger to hit harder. Its not fair that drks, heros or even shad has such mobbing skills and night lord only have a super mediocre one. One more line please
Avenger isn't that bad compared to other 3rd job skills, it's stronger than the BM mobbing skills and also a stronger than sair without the ship. Combined with the mobility from flash jump NL is actually pretty decent at farming weak mobs (like getting cards/event items) but is bad against strong mobs like the ones in LHC, Neo Tokyo, Shaolin etc
I agree. Nl is a lone wolf. People want their help for some bosses but give no help to the party besides dps and haste.
they nerf nl blindly because of those end game NL players are too op, but for others its just unplayable. Its like you play for years with many decent eqs on many chars, then put all your resources into a new NL. Then maybe you will get a decent NL, or maybe an average NL.
Obligatory please take this information as a player's opinion, not as a member of Staff's opinion. Shadow Stars - I can see that being a reasonable buff mainly because ST doesn't get dispelled and same goes to AC. I thought it was a bit annoying too when I was playing my BM during the Soul Arrow change even though I was still saving arrows, I was also losing them too in HT. I'm only speaking from experience because my partner's NL is level 197 and we do mostly everything together anyways so I kind of have a full understanding of how the class works but I'd be more confident when mine eventually reaches a higher level. And it makes sense to make that also be undispelled if two classes already have undispellable skills. Avenger - As it was already said by somebody else Avenger is already a pretty strong 3rd job skill compared to other classes. They already can kill low level mobs efficiently, especially paired with FJ. In your example of LHC there would have to be a buff made to Avenger to at least over 500-700%+ for them to even compete with other classes that were designed specifically for multi-targeting. Keep in mind this is a 3rd job skill we are talking about. That would blow all of the other 3rd job skills completely out of the water in comparison. NL's are still the supreme single target melting machine (unless SE dc's, or a really good Sair takes your white away) expecting it to underperform against classes that were designed specifically for multi-targeting is exactly where the tradeoff is for their high single target damage output. I know you said a slight buff in your original thread, however I don't think a slight buff would cut it and there would be another suggestion asking for another 'slight' buff to be made to it again if it were to happen. Last but not least NL's participation in LHC - NLs can actually do LHC. I've been trying for months now to recruit another 5 NL 1 BM Castle Golem run (my partner did one back when he was mid 180s and he gained 20-25% with stoppers at Under the Tall Walls 1. We haven't been able to get another party together since.) The hard part is trying to convince other people to try this out. So if you are willing to, we only need 4 more NLs and we can recruit some Castle Golem runs for a 5 NL 1 BM party. I suspect NLs would most likely have to do apple runs which can be a bit pricey if being done constantly to have the same consistent EXP from multi-target LHC. But single target LHC can be done-- we just need more people to participate in it as I only have 1 party as a sample size right now.
@Becca Thanks for the elaborate reply! Glad to hear that you think making Shadow Stars an undispellable skill sounds reasonable (from a player's perspective). For me this was the main point I wanted to adress in this thread. Like I said in my opening post I'm fully aware that there's a trade off to be made when being able to put out big single target DPS. Although being 'unable' to do LHC and miss out on the powerleveling really sucks, I wasn't vouching for NL's to get competitive in LHC. Simply wanted a small buff for Avenger to get around in some solo play. Anyway, I didn't really think through that this would mean that a 3rd job Hermit would benefit substantially from doing so and might get imbalanced compared to other classes. I would be down for a party that you mention, however I'm pretty sure recruiting for one is near-impossible. On a side-note: I can feel some frustration in the comments about avoid, shifter and alchemist. How do you feel about that? I mean, it basically hurt the class right in its essence to nerf that part.
https://royals.ms/forum/threads/update-71-02-04-2021.188095/#post-1100066 and https://royals.ms/forum/threads/update-71-1-08-04-2021.188568/2 of the 3 were already reverted back in April 2021... There's not really much to say as Staff's summary was essentially summed up in the little spoiler tags discussing our thoughts/reason behind why we decided to try that method in the first place so I really don't have anything else to add to that, sorry. As for Alchemist getting slightly adjusted I do think that was a fair call to make. Considering they used to be able to benefit from 15min apples and it was adjusted to around I believe 12- ish minutes. (..? I think that's correct, since I don't play one myself and only have second-hand experience as my main duo person is strictly NL. Please feel free to correct me though if I am wrong about the accurate times with Alchemist.)
Oh right. Like I said, I only joined a few months back so I'm not fully aware of all changes. But I did read both threads now and I think you are wrong as only 1 out of 3 is reverted? The avoidability change was reverted, but Shadow Shifter is still 20% (just checked in-game, also it says in the patch note), while it is supposed to be 30% (OG Maple) for NL. Alchemist went from 150 > 125% so I've read, meaning 15mins > 12m30sec for apples. It's still decent, but I don't really see why it needed a change. NL is so expensive already, can't they benefit from at least the alchemist skill how it was originally designed? Back to main topic; I mainly wanted to adress Shadow Stars as I expected the (less recent) nerfs wouldn't be changed anyway.
How is NL expensive? According to this https://royals.ms/forum/threads/hp-washing-for-new-players.41129/ Sair/MM/BM all cost more to wash. I would bet Alchemist by itself covers the cost of recharging stars, and the market is plentiful with NL gear. You can get 20 cilbis for 3b. The amount of attacks you dodge saves you a ton in pots over your life playing NL. Imo, the only place you should ever be having trouble with DP on Shadow Star is Auf, HT doesn't do it nearly as much to warrant a buff. Is a DP from auf missable based on avoidability, because then it's even less a problem. Compared to other classes, NL duo attacker is already super popular, I don't see a reason to make their lives even cushier in comparison.
NL isn't really more expensive than other attackers, their washing is easier than archers and sairs and craven is comparable to other weapons in price. Sleeves are indeed very expensive but they aren't really nessecary. It's just that the class is very popular and most of the richest people have it so it's more competitive in terms of range
Okay can we just go back to the main reason I opened this thread? Make Shadow Stars not cancel out when dispel. NL is not expensive and do not deserve 150% alchemist, okay?
