*NEWER* Community Blacklist

I'm going to stop posting about this. There is clearly no support for this section on the list. It is pointless and for some reason you guys can't see that.

 

Just to exchange some words on how to make the thread flow better than it does now. You don't need to take these advice I'll be giving. It's your own doing and I'm just here to help, I accept that.

The shoutbox should remain as follows; People who are new to the forum or are not online as often can be confused or lost and may cause problem such as being annoying to the community by not reading the title above the chatbox. This will cause a lot of people, even staff member, to be driven to nuts.
However, such thing is not something I see as reportable. Try to focus on keeping the bad ones gone and not the lost ones.
On a side note, the whole shoutbox thing is completely irrelevant to me but it may be a better idea for the community.

And as for evidence, I want a sub blacklist for plausible crimes. Not confirmed ones. A second chance, in matter fact. But only for the ones that has been falsely accussed of someone who thought the guy was gonna something expected etc.

 

I do support to have the community black list to have awareness of potential scams and such whether how petty it is, but does this have to be taken as far to regards to the shout box ? I don't see how this would ruin your shoutout experience, whether this do constitute towards a ban or not, people would still do this as they might not know or that they are being frustrated given the current situation, I personally think that these dissatisfaction is reasonable although it doesn't change anything.

When you see people trying to contact gm or what you call harassing in the shout box, simply advice them not do or just ignore them. This is simply because we humans, are capable of acknowledging something , and I believe over time they would stop doing so. I don't understand why would you report something which doesn't even affect your gameplay.

 

If you're going to keep a list of annoying people in the shout box, might as well have a list of annoying people who use Super Megaphones. It's an equal level of toxicity, and I know a lot of players who post annoying Smegas. Not that I play any more, but the annoying people still do. Maybe that's why I quit...

 

Annnnnnd now I regret making this in the first place. It's completely flown off the handle of it's main intent. rest in peace legitimacy and welcome in the era of butthurt people being straight up dicks to anyone they please.

 

the blacklist exists so that we can take care of issues that GMs don't. if someone harassed you, post in the report abuse section. if the aggressor gets banned, that's the end of it. if they don't, it wasn't deemed harassment and you shouldn't post on the blacklist crying about it. same goes for not having proof. if you don't have proof, don't post in the blacklist crying about it.

the blacklist is for scammers (this includes mislooting drops, WITH PROOF) and for things that people do that somehow "get around the rules" (such as "KSing" after a server freeze when mapowner is lost, WITH PROOF). GMs don't handle those issues, they let the community find the bad apples and work as a group to avoid them. it's not for annoying people, it's not for crying about your report being turned down because you had no proof, and it's not for fucking shoutbox issues (you guys are ridiculous). if you want to have your own guild or personal blacklist then do it, the people who care about that will have their list and nobody else will give a shit what you do.

 

^ While you are entitled to your opinions, as well as I or anyone else, there was absolutely no reason to be rude about it.

He cares enough about the community to make and maintain a place to put this stuff, I don't see where you get off being rude about your opinion.

 

I think it is already clear that the shoutbox section isn't something that everyone wants, so Kevin is obviously going to take that section down since this thread was created for the community after all. There is no need to repeat this same sentiment 1000 more times which each reply becoming increasingly rude, seeing as Kevin made this with good intentions and is taking everyone's criticisms into consideration. I don't understand why this discussion has become so intense when it is such a minor thing that can be easily fixed. it aint that srs yall

 

the shoutbox thing should have been left out to begin with and voted to be added, we shouldn't have to be voting to have it removed. the OP including it with "this one's for me" and with no other community input (which the OP says s/he cares about) is what ticked people off and made it seem like a personal list

 

I'm gonna be honest here and tell you that these blacklists are useless. The fact that the same names are being repeated over and over again proves it. Not to mention most of these people are on the list for the stupidest reasons (taking a quick glance over the names I disagree with 90% of them). How are we suppose to take this seriously when people who've scammed 1 single fame are on it? Since January (when the original blacklist was posted) up until now, there's only been 20 or so people that made it onto the official list. In a timespan of 9 months, only 20 people have been blacklisted. What does this mean? It means people don't care enough. Also, who is this community blacklist suppose to be targeted towards? New players? Those people probably won't find this thread until they've played long enough to be able to manage themselves. Experienced players? We've already got a good judgement on who to trust and who not to trust.

The only purpose I see in this blacklist is maybe for scammers. I'm not talking about bundling shop scams or fame scams, I mean like leech scams and looting boss runs. Heck, bundling shop scams shouldn't even be on this list, that's on you if you're careless enough to fall for it. As for harassment and shoutbox issues, those shouldn't be on the list either.

 

Update to this thread:
Since SOME of the posts over the last day did actually add to the argument, and help provide insight, I have decided to remove the shoutbox section.

In addition, for now I won't be separating the posts without solid proof from those with. I feel as though providing links to all related posts makes it easy enough for you to click and double check the report anyways. And I feel as though most people would do that naturally. Keeping it in the same section helps prevent the overall list from being cluttered and easier to use IMO.

Finally, I want to remind people that if you're going to post, make sure you're actually adding something to the discussion. A post that is just the same thing that someone said, except more offensively just makes an argument look weaker. Feel free to post that you agree with someone,but there is no reason to add insults.

 

Except he rectified that and took the part about "this one's for me" out because it was deemed unprofessional. Also, I don't see why the shoutbox thing "should have been left out." That is YOUR opinion. And quite frankly, people can have differing opinions. Like I for one think it's okay to have as long as it's to mention repeat offenders/people who are being toxic in the shoutbox (with evidence of that). Either way he already removed it so, that's done with.

I don't see anything wrong with having a stuff put up. People who want it can look, and if you don't need it then you can skip over it as well. By having the most information possible, it's easy to see who or what I can avoid. Take harassment for example. Harassment is subjective because people have varying levels of tolerance for it. Just because yours might be high, doesn't mean that that should be the tolerance cap for everyone. Also, by seeing that there is a track record for even minor offenses (in other peoples' eyes), it might be enough evidence to support a ban.

 

The same could be said for anything that people get scammed for. Hence the reason why staff doesn't intervene. Because regardless of the type of scam, it's generally on the other person for being "careless" enough to fall for it. Or to put it another way, engaging in any activity where there's a risk involved is your fault for taking that risk.

Selling Zakum Helms for example is risky, and if someone loots a Zakum Helm and doesn't pay, one could see it as that the person(s) selling it were being "careless" enough to allow someone they don't know in on a Zakum run with them. It's still seen as distasteful and toxic for someone to do that. But if the person doesn't want to take a risk of having Zakum Helmets being looted, then they could be more cautious on who they take. Which, yes, is exactly what the blacklist is for.

Now, when someone gets put up there for say, putting a bundling shop scam in their merchant, it's telling the community that, hey, "Player1337 sells summoning rocks, but if you buy from him, be sure to double check his store before purchasing." It's not that much different from saying, "Hey, Player1337 scams Zakum Helmets. Be careful if he wants to buy one from you/your guild."

In fact, to look at it another way, someone who scams things like Zakum Helmets, or to drive my point further, level 10 Mastery Books (TT 10, for example), might have less of a reason to be up there than someone who does a bundle shop scam. Why? Well, if someone looted TT 10, for example, they aren't going to need to go on anymore Zakum runs to acquire that skill. Someone who does a bundle shop scam can do it everyday all day, as long as they have the items and their shop open, they can continue to "scam" indefinitely.

 

You can say it's pointless, sure people add people to this for pointless reasons, but then you can read the reason and decide whether thats worth anything and form your own opinion on the matter. who cares.

I'm just gonna re-add these fucbois cause they still owe me

IGN: imgosu (Lmgosu?)
Reason for blacklisting: never gave me my gen20 cut, just ignores me when i ask about it. He volunteered to sell it and distribute the cuts, but he didn't follow through.

IGN: saiyagotenks
Reason for blacklisting: stole an eye of fire. was given to me to get into zak, and when i attempted to give it back to its owner he came and looted it, as a buyer, when asked to give it back just start swearing and threw a fit of broken ass english.

 

I disagree, people who scam zhelms/sb are the people that need to be here the most. It is true that many of them will probably never need to "buy" a zhelm again but when I look at this list I dont think "oh ok I won't sell zhelms to that guy", I think "well that is a guy who I will never do a boss run with". If this people are mislooting helmet then there is a high change they will misloot skillbooks at ht when they are higher level and this is a good way to spot and keep track of this kind of people.

 

You're wrong because when it comes to buying leech or selling helms, you have no control over the other players and these transactions are solely based off trust whereas buying items off a shop is entirely on you.

 

That's my point. There's no binding contract and they technically aren't breaking any rules. It's based solely off of trust and it's entirely on you for trusting that person. The same can be said for the shop scam. You're trusting that the person is being consistent with the rest of the shop items until you realize that, oh shit, he secretly hid a stack of Zombie's Lost Tooth for way too much money. Should you have been more careful when buying? Yes. But it was more than likely the intention of the shop owner to prey on people to trust their store too much and just assume all items will be at a fair price, just like it's the intention of Helmet scammers to prey on people to trust them to pay after they looted.

This addresses the post above yours as well. I'm not saying that Helmet looters and SB scammers and such shouldn't be up there, and yes, it helps to let people know to avoid them for future runs like Horntail.
At the end of the day, pretty much any scam can be avoided with a little extra caution. A few posts up, someone wants to report someone for looting an Eye of Fire. I'm not disagreeing with his decision to want to report it to the Blacklist, but just to use it as an example, that could have been avoided by trading the Eye or dropping it away from others who may or may not loot it.

 

lol, this is what i got from what you said: "i fucked up but i don't want to be held responsible and admit own my dumbass mistakes"

What makes you think blacklisting these shop scammers will help? If these careless people failed to see summoning rocks being sold for 1mil each, what makes you think these same people be wary of bundle scammers in the future? Also, blacklisting these shop scammers prevents nothing. So now you know that RamboTW bundle scams, congratulations, you stumble upon his shop with 1mil summoning rocks that you're more than likely not going to buy anyways regardless if you knew prior if RamboTW was a scammer or not.

 

To each their own, my friend. Perhaps blacklisting won't help you or I, but it may help others. What's it hurting?
The only reason why Zakum Helmets scams are seen as more acceptable to blacklist is because there is a bigger monopoly on it. Yes, obviously that gives it grounds to be a viable reason to blacklist users. But just because a shop scam is perhaps easier to avoid, it doesn't make it any less of a scam.

 

What's it hurting? People love to judge books by their cover. When you add these names onto the list you're essentially shunning them from the community. Even if the person may have done something as petty as scamming a single fame, that person's name and reputation will forever be tainted for the simple fact that their name is on the blacklist. People see a serious stickied thread like this and they won't think twice to make unfair judgments and avoid these people for reasons they might not even fully know. Like I said earlier, most of what gets reported here aren't even worth bringing up, let alone making it onto the list. So yeah I guess if you don't care if people are being unfairly reported then I guess it's okay to post every minor dispute.

Inversion said it above that people here are using this as a personal thread and that's exactly what this is. These victims don't give 1 fuck if these scammers continue to scam others, they're just mad that they didn't get paid for selling zakum helms or didn't get leeched after paying and want to them suffer. Threads like these just reinforce that mindset and that's wrong. Knowing how this community is, I don't think that's ever going to change.