Map ownership/ksing

I'm saying it can't happen... if you're attacking in short enough intervals it should be impossible for it to happen if it does then that should be reported as a bug. If someone is able to steal your map while youre there you've failed to attack within the given time its completely your fault. I agree that it would suck to lose a half killed bf or w.e especially since the person stealing it isnt even going to get good exp from that. I do however not agree with it being a flaw with the mapowner mechanics in this case.

It is not a flaw it is the way mapowner was intended to be. The reason why its there is not so that you can be inactive and do other stuff while you're playing its just there so that you don't instantly lose the map if you fail to attack for a short amount of time.

 

@Hampa you're contradicting yourself by saying it not flawed, if I just attack every minute or so.

That like saying gfx on bossing is fine to have. Just because it a temp solution, doesn't make it right. Sure gfx takes few seconds but it's very annoying to do. I know they are working on fixes not complaining just giving an example.

You're saying even though a car drove into me at 200miles an hour, it's completely my fault for not avoiding it. Youre right I can attack every few minutes but it just slows the process of the fight completely down for a shadower. Making a usually 7-10min fight even longer, shouldn't be necessary to secure a map im already in and killing actively. Stuff happens man that can easily make you miss your 3 min mark even if happens like 1 in 1000.

Frustrating thing when someone is abusing the map ownership system. basically alllowing a toxic and Ks player take control. Normal server people we just negotiate and share the map or work something out. Even offered the guy party to share kill but says cc plz and afks in map for 10mins claiming to get me banned. Can see why I'm frustrated.

 

I once was at an empty ULU 2 map when all other channels are full. So I typed ~mapowner and it says no one owns the map. I took the map and gained ownership. But someone just comes in and ask me to CC saying they were there first as their door is there. (I honestly did not see the door though) I told them I don't see red dot on the map and i ~mapowner, there's no one that owns the map but they literally bullied me out of the map.

But being human and having a sense of compassion, I left the map anyway and told myself to call it a day since they kept insisting that the door was there.

On the other hand, I found a BF boss and was in dark sight trying to whisper my party members to come join me - not expecting someone to come in and gene it instantly and dying to BF then coming back to the map and keep asking us to CC and spamming ~mapowner. He did not/ was not actively hitting the boss, all he did was to hit the mobs around the map and also he was incapable of killing BF as a sub-low level bishop. So he was literally hogging it when we took the HP down to 30%. We offered him a spot in the party but he declined and kept threatening to post on forums lol.

I left anyway but what what a waste of my stars and time.

 

For this part, fully knowing how mapownership works, you can come up with ways to shorten the time you need to spend at town. For e.g I rearrange inventory and put all the valuable items to-be-stored on the top of equip inven, put all the mob etc on the top of ETC tab so I can npc them quickly. Once that's done I'd open the mystic door and hit any mob before entering the door. NPCing all the equips + etc (once every 3~4 turn in) and storing few good equips shouldn't take longer than 2min at max. IF one happens to go over 3min...that's just unfortunate on their side but as other mages also need leeching maps, one has forfeited it.

Next time, tell those ulu2 previous-map-owners to go and read T&C of royals. There is no such thing as "Map stealing" in royals, otherwise I can park a lvl 7 mule with a chalkboard in ulu2 and say I arrived here 3months and 4 days ago therefore it's rightfully mine. If they carry on harassing you to leave the map although your mapownership is clearly imprinted, simply follow the KS/harassment report format and report them for jolly 3day ban.

 

I've been playing maple since 2005 and in my time, I can count the number of times where this happened on like 1 hand. GMS was a nightmare, everyone KS'd each other. It basically boiled down to willpower and accepting less exp for X amount of time till the person left your map. The only way to "hold" a map was to successfully kill faster than anyone who tried to take it thus driving people away.

It was much more common to just concede and not deal with the headache and share a map. lol I dunno, maybe I just remember old maple different. That's why I spent so much time in non-traditional maps, to get away from people. Mapowner, while having it's issues, I personally feel the pros greatly outweigh cons as a definitive method of deciding who has the map.

edit: woops..somehow tagged everything with a link to Hampa.. lol

 

@Evan yeah I didn't mean Ksing was more common on maple royals. Didn't really word it properly. It's much worse on gms. GMS Gm do nothing, where here you guys are actively trying to prevent it.

It's honestly not an issue, depending on how a Gm intpretes the current system. Whether I would get banned for ksing with just a screenshot of me hitting Bigfoot and saying other player owns the map. Drawing attention to this issue as it's not always set and stone.

The map ownership command doesn't always tell the full story is what I'm getting at. Like seen in my situation, anyone that watch from the moment I hit the boss and was in map till the very end would say 100% I would be the owner. However the map ownership would say otherwise.

I can't record every time I play, would take a lot of memory and become even more tiring then dealing with the kser.

Kai has given me his interpretation of he rule and I quite happy with outcome, if it's atleast reviewed and not just a trigger happy ban for a little screenshot that doesn't tell the story, in my case tells the opposite.

Thanks Evan.

 

Yes it is your fault for not avoiding it. Using your example, you didn't adhere to the warning that said "You can/will be hit by cars if you don't follow the foolproof procedure that keeps you 100% safe". It states directly in the Terms & Conditions that in MapleRoyals we have a simple mechanic that allows you to never lose your map as long as you follow it. We've made it common knowledge that no matter what you're doing in the map that you own, you must attack at least once per three minutes in order to keep it for yourself. It's literally impossible for someone to steal a map because for someone to gain map ownership the map had to have belonged to nobody.

Stuff can happen to make you miss your 3 minute mark but we've decided that not attacking for 3 minutes means that you no longer own the map. No matter the time limit, whether it be 3, 5, or 10+ minutes, things can always come up that can make you miss your mark.

A KSing ban is already far from a trigger happy ban for a little screenshot. We have guidelines that prevent this from being the case:

https://royals.ms/forum/threads/new-report-abuse-format-for-ksing.57289/

I personally believe that the only flaw is in that you can hold maps in different channels at the same time but there has since been discussion on how to remedy this.

 

@Eli Thanks for the reply

Hahah you'd make a great insurance agent . Yeah I'm aware of the guidelines and try to follow as best as possible to prevent it.

Regards to not attack for 3 mins, guess it yet another downside to shadower T_T. I believe droping meso as a shadower is part of the attack rotation and treat it the same way, but the ownership doesn't. I will just have to work around it and most of the time people will leave, just a rare few.

That's good to hear, as the guy that ks me was basically threaten that john will ban me with a simple screenshot. Scared off everyone in our party and we ended up just giving the toxic guy the map.

On a side note, with bigfoot theres this unusual bug that happens sometimes, where he legit flys across the screen almost, kinda like a hacker is vaccing him. It usually happens when Bs draws aggro on otherside and rushes over. Pings back and forward very quickly. I may make a separate post in bugs when I catch in on recording. I don't think its just bigfoot, seen it at Wolf spiders too where they all just clapse on top of me once when leeching.

 

... you were in a party now? How the heck did a party lose map ownership to someone who just arrived?

 

Yes haha, but the others are bishop and low level, I'm the only attacker. The rest sit on the other side of the map, because if they attack it Aggros the boss and stuffs up my pinning. Also
My night lord wife is stingy on her stars.

 

I have 2c about the ownership, I never took the time to open a thread about it, because it never bothered me like it happened to OP.

1. I agree the timer (3mins) is too short. Yes, you can go to Town and NPC everything in less than 3 minutes with door.
But what if you don't have a door? I used to grind for some exp at Voodoos with my Ironman Warrior, alone, and it is a highly used map.
Also too far to be able to go NPC and come back walking in less than 3 minutes.
NPCing isn't the only issue about the 3mins. What if you need to go to toilet? Or hang on the phone? Or someone called you at the front door?
There are N things that can take off your attention from grinding for ~3mins, ~5 mins.
I believe there would be less people to disagree that ownership should be resetted with 10mins.

2. I highly disagree with BOSS Maps have this feature work the same way as grinding maps.
First, people could hold all 20 channels by attacking and ccing often, waiting for all the bosses to respawn.
Second, could happen to anyone what happened to OP, you're almost finished killing the boss, waiting for some friend/hser/buyer to come by,
then someone comes up and steals the whole map, boss included? That's gross.
I believe it would be simple to the boss hunters to Screenshot the time he started killing it as a proof he was there first, and hold it in
case something like that happens.

 

If you don't have door then you can use a teleport rock in most cases. Your example isn't great because you can't use Mystic Door at Voodoos anyway which puts you on equal footing with every other class that lacks it(Other classes without teleport go to voodoos too).

The mapowner command is here to prevent active players in their maps from kill stealing and looting. If you choose to go AFK, leave the map, or stop attacking for whatever reason then you're leaving the map inactive. Why should the command cater to someone's needs outside of anything other than training in the map? If you leave your map open then an active player should be able to claim it instead. If you need to go do something then you can call a buddy to come and actively use your map while you're gone. I can't even count the number of times I've held maps for friends who needed to go do something or vice versa.

How is it any different in boss maps? You've carelessly allowed the map to become vacant by sitting there and failing to do anything for over 3 minutes. If you're waiting for someone to come then all you need to do is hit something once(Or be more prepared in the first place). I think it becomes way more complicated in your suggestion. I say this because then it requires you to take a screenshot every time you start to kill a boss rather than just having a simple in-game command do that for you. What would you do if someone did come along and gain ownership the map? Claim that you have a screenshot of when you started killing it while having no proof that you were there for any other duration of the kill and then find some way to send the screenshot to the new person in the map? I'm not sure how this would ever be more simple than typing ~mapowner and attacking once per 3 minutes.

 

@Eli
Exactly because it's not everyone who has a way to get back faster is that we need more time before losing the ownership.
And you can't know when you will need to leave the computer for a minute or two, in order to find someone to hold a map.
Ex. "I have to go to the toilet now, I can't wait 2~5 minutes to find someone."
The time should be enought for any incovenient and/or unpredicted reason to make you afk/leave for a few minutes.
3 minutes is not enought for most of the said reasons.

About the boss thing, taking a screenshot as you start killing a boss was just an idea for having a way to proof you were the first one
to find/attack such boss, in case someone comes and somehow gets the map ownership while you're in the halfway to kill it.
Some people said something about recording, and such thing is way harder than a single screenshot.
That screenshot is not supposed to be sent to the person who's "stealing" the map, but to be hold for an incovenient ban appeal.

 

Using your voodoo example again, I chose a map that is equally far away from a merchant NPC and recreated the scenario while having only 115% speed and I was able to get back with over a minute to spare

Spoiler

I'm still wondering why the command should cater to someone who needs to go AFK for whatever reason rather than to someone who is actively playing the game. Again I'll state that mapowner is specifically designed to prevent KSing, not to allow you to leave the computer or the map. Should a map in a game belong to an AFK player? There will always be someone who doesn't like whichever arbitrary number of minutes leeway is given for a player to own an inactive map whether that be because they want it to be longer to cater to needs outside of the game or because they believe that it's too long for someone to inactively hold a map.

If your solution to this is meant to help during ban appeals then isn't it already too late? Ideally we'd want to prevent people from being banned in the first place.

 

In the 2+ years I've been here, I've had approximately 1 issue with Mapowner. And it was easily resolved as I just found another map to train on after i went afk too long. I'm not that worked up over min maxing my Training that much, that I would get that worried about Mapowner. But thats just me.

Lets just remove Mapowner all together and allow us to KS each other again. One of the finer moments I remember from GMS were the huge KS wars that would occur every once in a while.

#MuhNostalgia

 

I'd like to ask you to think about it as a player for a second.
You're grinding at a high poppulated map (ulu2/petris/etc) for 2+ hours, and for any unpredicted reason you had to afk for ~5 minutes.
Then you get back to your grinding, and find out that someone has taken your map.
You do what? Just quit game because your grinding free-time is messed up.

Today these maps are less populated as old source, but it might get back as soon as the server's issues get fixed.

Ohhh I LOVED Zombie's KS Wars!

 

Then don't leave your map. That's the risk you take. I don't really get why this is such a difficult concept to grasp, but mapowner wasn't put into place so you could safely afk for 3 minutes, it was so you couldn't lose it when you are actively using it. I see how it sucks for shadowers since they require set up unlike other chars, but as it is mapowner was intended to stop people from ksing while you grind. The solution that was provided with mapowner was to help protect that and it was the best that could be coded. Leaving your map or afking on it for whatever reason means you risk losing your map. I honestly think 3 minutes is more than fair if you are actively using the map.

 

Uhh, what's the problem with losing your map if you went afk for 5 minutes? That's... that's how it works, right? You afk for a certain period of time, you lose the map ownership. If you don't wanna lose the ownership, don't afk for longer than 3 minutes.

Otherwise people can hog maps all day long, and that isn't fair.

 

Regarding the new report for ksing, I am very confused.
The thread sounds to me saying "cc plz" and showing "~mapowner" is not sufficient to notify a non-mapowner to leave. It seems to me that the mapowner should state clearly he/she owns the map and ksing is bannable and then ask the person to change channel literaly.
However, based on the cases in ban appeal, it seems only saying "cc plz", showing "~mapowner", then recording two time points longer than 2 minutes is more than enough as an evidence for ksing report .

 

I believe it is no longer required since the kser in question was required to read the rules and accept them upon registering and it was decided that the owner of the map should not be responsible for telling them the rules. I believe the thread simply hasn't been updated to reflect that, but I'm sure a staff member can clarify that if needed.