Petrifighter Spawn Change (My Compromise Suggestion)

Just to clarify things a bit so there aren't any misconceptions.

Before Ulu and ToT were released the spawn rates were actually buffed. And the current rate is closer to the original (re: unbuffed) rates.

Ulu and ToT were never meant as replacements to Skeles or anywhere else, just as alternatives. We want the grinding spots to be as balanced as possible so people don't feel like they're stuck to one area (what I call the Ghost Ship Complex). Problem with balancing is that Nexon had no idea how to do that, so we're having to mess around with it a bit to find a good balance.

There was no announcement for the original Petri need because, 1) they were too OP, and 2) it wasn't a completely final decision.

 

As a FPAM, I personally agree the Petris were overly fast at spawning however they yield better EXP that way than at Newties/F.Golems. I could do a level every 1.5 hours at Petris and it takes upwards of 2-3 hours at Newties/F.Golems.

I feel that debuffing the spawn rate at Petris is a horrible move since Bishops get the upper hand of more exp with Holy Symbol and selling leeches. Yes it still benefits them, but when it comes down to it FPAM's get the short end of the stick if you debuff.

 

There is no denying the spawn was too OP, I think everyone with a bit of sense can only agree with that. Even for me as a NL it was way faster for me to train here than anywhere else, inlcuding Anego/BF/zak arms.

Obviously arch mages that can 1hko these had the upper hand, so the best combo was:
- 1hko arch mage
- HS mule
- attacker (me)

But even with a bishop it was way faster than say, anego. (most bishops don't 1hko skeles anyway. Petris is obviously the same.)

This reduced my time to gain a level from 12-16 hours (depending on where I train) to easily 6-8 hours.

But, like Rob said, the nerf isn't by any means final. It is just not very easy to make all the maps as balanced as we want them to be. I'd rather see them nerfed a bit too much and gradually seeing them leveled with the 'rest' than the contrary.

Who knows, some other maps might even get buffed. I just don't see how it is unreasonable to experiment with changes in spawn like this. We can test all we want, but the real output will always be seen on the live server, which is the purpose to begin with.

 

I'm just trying to point out that it doesn't make sense to nerf something past the point where it's pretty much trash. The extra content isn't going to even be used as often (besides krexel-- assuming that's been buffed in terms of EXP), completely defeating the purpose of it being added in the first place. Rob brought up the fact that Nexon didn't balance out certain maps appropriately but, I don't think them balancing things out was ever their intention. New added content had the tendency to be better spots for people so these maps would actually be used. Plus, this is content from later versions of maplestory so, what exactly would they need to balance? q_q

It's more or less like it was never added to Royals.
I think the lag is more important than people leveling a bit too quickly.

 

I completely agree that the spawn for petris was OP. The problem that most of us have is that the nerf made the map degrading to grind at. I don't see a point in making these as just alternatives because people find the best map to grind when they are towards end game. For Bishops that map is skeles (especially with the spawn buff a while back). For us Arch Mages, it was the petri map. And now that style of grinding is worse to where we don't even find a benefit for training there anymore especially after how it was before.

All I want is there to be a balance between bishop training and arch mage training. And right now, Bishops have the advantage because they can just go back to skeles no problem. All the proof you need is in the rankings. In the top 100; 64 bishops and only 9 arch mages.

In my original post I mentioned like a quarter increase just to what the current petri map nerf is now. We all want positives/increases (doesn't matter by how much) because psychologically, it's appealing whether something increased by 100%, 10%, 20% or even 1%. Positives of any amount are good.

 

I might be wrong here, but I think that any fine tuning of the spawn would have to be done via .wz edits, which would involve people having to download new files. Otherwise, I think we're limited to single spawn or double spawn.

 

I completely agree. This is why Petri's were nerfed, because they made Sleles completely obsolete.

Of course Nexon wanted new content to be better than old, it helped them make money. We're not Nexon, which is to say we're not in it for the money. We're here to provide a quality MapleStory experience that Nexon couldn't provide. Aren't we here because we weren't happy with where Nexon took the game?

The time the devs spent to make this change was absolutely nothing compared to how hard they've been working on the lag issues.

 

If you aren't going to make new content better than the old, then nobody is even going to use the new content. The amount of people i've seen at ToT so far (besides doing the initial quests) IS SO LOW, and basically none existent, simply because the EXP isn't that good as it was in the original versions. The only reason people even go to ToT is to do the chain quests, hunt some rare 60% scrolls and hunt rare books. Was it worth all that trouble to add ToT if no one is going to use it? I don't think it would be wrong at all for Petris/Dukus to be better than Skelegons for some attackers, Skelegons is a bishop map, since they are holy weak and a strong Petris/Dukus doesn't change that, because Bishops have to 2 hit them. The current nerf on Petrifighters is definitely not the way to go, you are just giving into the BishopOP train, by still making Skelegons the last map to train on, why not something different to balance it out???

 

You're missing the first, and most important, point. New content shouldn't be so OP as to make old content obsolete and vice-versa. This is what I'm saying Nexon did wrong.

 

Well that is wrong completely.

What is the point of new content if there is nothing new to gain from them? Because right now Skelegons is going to make the new maps obsolete, and Temple of Time is obsolete. What was the point of the Hype and months of waiting if it's going to be trash and we end up going back to Skelegons.

If that is your way of thinking then Orbis/Ludi/Elnath/Leafre and everything pass Victoria Island shouldn't of been released because it made the original content in Victoria island obsolete. If you argue that those towns provided new training content for higher levels, I can say that Temple of Time is suppose to provide the same thing, but it doesn't since Skelegons is still THE MAP TO GO TO.

Like I said, Skelegons is still a Bishop map (which they can even solo), it doesn't make it obsolete to have other maps. What is happening is way too conservative.

 

You're still misunderstanding.... And your comparison is completely wrong. Victoria Island is a place for lower levels, no other place makes it obsolete. They're just higher leveled places.

There is always something to gain from new content even if it's not OP or makes other places obsolete. It's new scenery, new ways of grinding, more class oriented grinding, etc. What you're completely missing is that no one went to Skeles anymore, even bishops, because Petri's were so good. You seem to be under the impression that we want Petri's to be worse. We don't. We want them to be comparable. We wanted Skeles to be more of a bishop grinding spot and Petri's for Arch Mages so neither one was obsolete.

EDIT: I forgot to add that no matter what we do someone won't be happy. If we try to balance grinding places this happens, if there's just one accepted grinding place GS2 happens. I've never seen anyone happy that GS2 is the only viable option for grinding from 50-70 (thank God LMPQ is up and running now).

 

And Temple of Time is suppose to be a higher levelled place compared to Skelegons so the exp should make Skelegons look obsolete, just like how Wraith makes Teddies obsolete.

Skelegons are level 113 and Chief Oblivion Guardians are level 131, there should be a considerate exp difference when grinding at those maps. Or ELSE BISHOPS WILL NEVER LEAVE SKELEGONS.

New scenery only lasts so long, new ways of grinding? Maybe, but you are making Bishops stay at Skelegons, that isn't very new. More class oriented grinding? Well Leafre is now the place to go, so as of current, no one will go to Petris/Dukus/ToT. So there isn't much orientation.

Edit:

The Difference is that level 120/130/140 people can't really clear Path to Oblivion, but they can clear Skelegons, so Road to Oblivion should be a more viable map for people 150+, AND A OBSOLETE ALTERNATIVE TO SKELEGONS. Temple of Time should be THE NEXT MAP UP! And seeing that you are going to nerf it to equal out to Skelegons is totally wrong.

 

Not true Petri's wasn't extremely popular. Skeles were still the better option if you 100% 3 hitted petris. Petri's were good for arch mages because most of them could 2 hit them. The only way a bishop would 2hit petri was if he had gene 20 which is like over 750mil and not many people are dedicated enough to a bishop to buy it for them. Skeles was still the better option Petri's were only good if you had decent dmg or were an attacking class.

 

I dunno, i heard from multiple people that they were going from 105 to 120 within several hours of Petri's. I'd like to see that at Skeles/newts too. I know some people who went up to 120+ and even past 140 in the week that I was gone and that Petris had come out, and then got nerfed. It was rather over powered, looking at it from that perspective, and it still seems like a viable option. I was there last night and it didn't seem that bad.

 

No one is asking for the new content to make the old obsolete.

We are simply asking it to be made balanced. Right now, Skeles make Ulu and ToT irrelevant as well, which is just as bad.

The nerf is justified, we can all agree. But it was overboard, why the hell is the main training area still Skeles. That's ridiculous, people should be getting better exp at higher level training spots like Dukus or Obliv and that's not the case. We aren't saying the nerf is wrong, we're saying it's not balanced.

 

Now, I can't speak of the exact way we're addressing this problem in the future, but I do have a couple of points to add to this thread.

1) The way that Ulu City was implemented was overpowered, and to the point that it did make other maps (read: Leafre) defunct as far as training goes. That was the purpose of our nerf; we would rather not have something overpowered in the game, end of story.

2) The current state of Ulu City and Temple of Time is likely not the long-term future of these areas. As others have mentioned in this very thread, we have many other issues to deal with at the moment, one primary one being our recent lag issues. We understand that every one of these maps have a niche in the training world (Petris for AMs that can't 2hit Skeles, Skeles for Bishops, Dukus for non-mage solo grinders and Oblivions for end-game, as a loose description) and I'm fairly confident that in time we will have those maps where they need to be.

3) We released new content to the community with the understanding that we are trying something to help you all. We did not release new content for the sake of making frilly banners and creating hype. We want you all to be happy, and we are continually trying to make that wish come true. The spawn on those maps was wrong. We are attempting to fix that. I personally apologize for the mistakes we have made thus far.

Please, have some patience with us. Quoting my own signature, there are bad ways to win. We did not want to have to kill Ulu City the way we did, but it was simply too strong to leave untouched. Fixing that issue meant the dissent that you currently all feel, but would you rather a completely broken map, or balanced maps with a wait?

 

The nerf of the maps is NOT what we are complaining about. I understand that Ulu was OP and superior to almost all other maps. I understand that you guys are trying to balance these maps out because Nexon didn't. I understand that the lag issues are more important to fix than this spawn situation. We don't want maps to be better than others, and like Annie said; skeles is for bishops, attackers for dukus, arch mages for petris, and end game attackers/mages for oblivion/regrets. Each class should have their grinding spot according to the attacks, damage, area of hitting, traveling around map, etc. Right now, that isn't the case and we are not expecting it to be perfect right away. We are giving you feedback as to what should be changed to keep the players happy and satisfied.

So, in the past the skele maps were buffed and bishops have been successful there. Petris/Dukus would need a buff (from where it is now) of about 7-10 more mobs. Road to Oblivion and Road of Regrets need about 10-13 more mobs per map (simply just because the maps are so big). As a F/P Arch Mage, i would love to grind and get decent exp from the high leveled qualm mobs. it's just there are not that many mobs that fit under my Meteor Shower and that is what a mages specialty is since we cant fight bosses. Mages are meant to be higher levels than attackers and there are supposed to be more of them because we are MOBBERS! that's how we do. attackers are more dynamic because they can fight BOSSES.

 

Were suggestions being considered at all? Changing the spawn rate for Petrifighter has jammed the Skele maps. There are not many places where Shadowers could train.

Still nobody is going to ToT if anyone noticed. I don't know if my small little suggestion will be considered or anything.

Good day, everyone.