As the game currently is, there isn't a single mob that drops Shield for Weapon Att 60% in the game. With the addition of Ninja Castle, we now have mobs that drop Shield for Weapon Att 10% and 30%. I would really like the option to farm for this scroll from something since you currently just have to gach for it. I don't understand why this scroll is locked behind gach exclusively. According to bbb.hidden-street.net, 2 of the Ninja Castle mobs drop Shield for Weapon Att 60%, but we have custom drop tables for those mobs on Royals. I would like to suggest adding this scroll to the Kunoichi drop table or perhaps a different mob (ToT mobs maybe). It doesn't really matter where as long as it's somewhere in the game. Maybe I'm seriously missing the point with this decision since it seems very intentional, so discussion is highly encouraged. Please correct me if I seem like an idiot. This request doesn't feel very outlandish and I don't see this unbalancing the game, since 1h is worse than 2h and shadowers aren't exactly top of the line in DPS.
Agree, if they insist on keeping NL overpowered and outclassing every other dps at least make it easier for shadowers to scroll up their crap.
No one is insisting on NL staying overpowered, even with a 30 attack Maple Shield (impossible with these 60% scrolls), you're still weaker than a NL... a lot of classes are. Shadowers have their perks, like Meso Shield, Meso Explosion, etc. As for the scrolls themselves, I'm not sure why they weren't added to the drop tables.. and from a strictly farming standpoint I get it, but, from an attack shield perspective. a 18-21 attack maple shield (9-10 scrolls passing), is one of the cheapest things you can buy for your character, there's a lot of middle ground attack shields (9-12 attack) that are essentially impossible to sell.
There is no lack of supply of Shield WA 60%. Not to mention the price of them, alongside Shield WA 30/70%, have been declining as of late. The demand isn't there to warrant any additional drops for any shield WA scrolls.
I buy out the fms shield attack scrolls once every 2 days. I usually get as little as 4-7 60% shield attack a day while I get 10-40 70% and 30% shield attack.
They aren't supposed to be anywhere near proportionately accessible. Similarly to Shield MA 60, Glove MA 60, Top LUK 60, Top STR 60, etc. There are far more 30/70 available than 60s, but there are still plenty of them in the market. You are also likely buying them at, or below market value (more plausible). I went through FM today and there were plenty unsold in the 10-15m range. In fact, I bought some @ 8m each due to them being so cheap. Also, you do not buy out the FM EOD as I have had countless Shield WA 30/70 for sale for weeks and they go often unsold @ 7-9m. If you bought out the FM, you would have bought me out too as they are in my shop on a routine basis. Please provide accurate information if you intend to discuss this further-lying about buying out the FM is not helping this discussion in any way.
OP is also Ironman, which means accessibility in the FM is moot in his argument (or isn't, depends on your stance)
It's not game breaking to have more 16 attack shields around. There was a much needed demand for mithril ores and the drop rate increased drastically. What's the standard set where some items can be dropped from mobs and where drop rates can increase or decrease? I use owls on to find to get my scrolls. If you sold shield 30 wa for 7-9 mil days ago I would have gotten it. I didn't think I had to mention not buying the 30% shield attacks that some people sold for over 30mil, but you are right.
With Mithril Ores there was a significant inflation caused by their excessive demand. With Shield WA (30/70/60) that isn't happening. It's actually been the opposite as of late-their price is on the decline. I feel it is simply unnecessary to add additional ways to access it as it will only further saturate the market and decrease the prices of both mid-low tier shields (21~ WA) and the scrolls themselves. As mentioned by another user prior, mid tier shields are both damn easy to access and afford already.
You stated that they aren't supposed to be proportionately accessible, and I mentioned that I noticed their intentional restriction in the first post. My issue is that I don't think they should be so reserved. There is no reason more decent shield shouldn't be around. There are no classes which prefer shield that are considered top tier. Heroes will be using 2h swords, not 1h sword and shield. Blunt weapon paladins have to use a shield and we all now where paladins are at. Shadowers are also forced to use shields and they aren't evven close to a top tier class either. I think it should be easier for these lower tier classes to have an easier time making a decent shield. It's still more difficult to scroll a weapon and a shield than any 1 weapon. If you wanted a perfect maple shield and weapon, that's 17 slots and it still won't be as powerful as a perfect 2h sword that only needs 7 slots. I totally understand why a scroll like Glove MA 60 is very reserved, but Shield for Weapon Attack scrolls are just simply not as powerful. I also feel like I should rephrase "lack of" because I don't keep any tabs on the market of this game. I have exclusively been playing ironman for like 2 years. When I say there is a lack of shield for weapon att scrolls, I mean that the game lacks options of obtaining this scroll, despite its relatively low power level. That's my real issue. I'm playing a shadower and I wanted to scroll up my dragon khanjar, but there is no way for me to play the game and obtain the item I need. I don't have the option of using 30% scrolls, because I only have 1 khanjar. Why go through the trouble of locking shield for weapon att 60% behind gach if shadower is so relatively weak anyway (as stated in the last paragraph)? As far as "demand" is concerned, the demand will never be high because all options that use shield for any class are relatively weak to other options. There are very few shadowers and there are even fewer blunt weapon paladins (although I'm sure the amount has increased as of late). No heroes are gonna use a shield over a stonetooth or dragon claymore.
What's wrong with inflation? Me and a few others even started training on Mithril ores just to take advantage of the shortage which creates more mores, but we got a drop increase when only a couple people even brought it up. Those scrolls can even drop from monsters no one trains on so why keep them out of the game?
I'm not on any sides here whether it should be a farmable scroll or not. Simply because I don't know how the demand is for that scroll specifically as well as it's affects on related scrolls/equips, and how many there are in the market, but based the posts above mine, it seems like with the price falling, there might be more scrolls in the market than what is being demanded .. However, as you're an Ironman and looking for a way to farm yourself that scroll so you can finish your equip, isn't the challenge of an Ironman is that you have to work hard yourself with a lot of effort and patience to be able to improve your character, instead of after getting unlucky gach runs or wanting to spend the gach time somewhere else, asking for that scroll to be obtainable from somewhere else ? I thought people played Ironman for their hard-earned efforts paying off by spending time, patience and effort and never looking for an easier/more convenient way out since they're Ironman and prefer the hard way .. If your argument is about the market demand and how there needs to be other ways of obtaining it for the better of the entire server since it being obtainable through only gach prevents many people's gameplay, then it would be a very valid argument. However if your argument is because you're an Ironman and just looking for an easier and more convenient way to obtain those scrolls, then, even though I admire your dedication in 2 years of playing only Ironman, you should show your patience even more. I believe a change should be made only if it's absolutely necessary and not to make it more convenient .. But, that's just my opinion anyway ..
I think I've made several valid points, through 2 long posts, on why this scroll should not be restricted to gachapon. I also feel pretty offended about how you talk down on how I play Ironman. I only made this post because it felt unfair. There are lots of very difficult and time consuming tasks I've had to put up with because of ironman, but I don't complain about it (in fact, I enjoy it!). You think I don't have patience? I solo'd Krex, but I didn't ask for his health to be reduced. I farmed 30 gold teeth, but didn't ask for the drop rate to increase. I collected 21 steel plates by myself. Ironman is hard, but I've presented plenty of legitimate reasons as to why the gachapon restriction doesn't make sense. Making an inferior strategy of play more difficult is retarded. People who choose to play with a shield (which is required for paladins and shadowers) have a much more difficult time scrolling their gear. I just feel like this creates for frustrating patterns of play for people who choose these options. This is less about me and more about everyone who will be playing these classes in the future. Why should I be restricted by gach because I have a paladin and shadower who need to scroll 17/14 slots when a hero can just slap 7 scrolls on their swordtooth and be done? I'm not asking that scrolls for weapons should be removed. The reason shadowers have scrolls for their shields is because the attack multiplier for daggers is much worse than that of a claw, so they have been offered options to increase their attack's flat value. So if a night lord scrolls their claw, they are much better off than when a shadower just scrolls their dagger. It's pretty clearly unbalanced. This is why I changed my paladin to swords with the most current sp reset. I'm not gonna waste my time with gaching crushed skulls and shield for attack 60%s. I feel like the meta game has evolved a bit past what the game is offering in many ways and this is just one way that I felt particularly frustrated by. Obviously, my perspective is warped by how I play. I just want a satisfying experience in my favorite game.
I didn't want to offend you in any way, in fact, I tried to show my admiration in your Ironman dedication as well as acknowledged how hard the Ironman Challenge is. You didn't have to remind what kind of struggles you've been through with your Ironman and don't understand how you got offended by my words or felt like I was talking down Ironman Class but, again, I'm sorry if I have offended you in any way .. I just posted that based on what you said here when you talked about how specifically your Ironman class had troubles finding the given scroll when finding the scrolls for other classes wasn't really an issue. Since both the scrolls and the scrolled shield prices are relatively low, I only saw this more of an Ironman problem which had been faced by many Ironmen before and stuck through it. It was hard, but that was a part of the challenge. I felt like this was more of a complaint on your end not being able to scroll rather than an improvement to the server. But I'm sorry if I misunderstood what you meant to say in there ... Your argument was "why not" when you talked about other classes. Yes for Paladins and Shadowers, a shield is a must but they are also both pretty underplayed classes unfortunately. That is the reason why the demand for those scrolls is low and that they are quite often available in fm so people who main these classes so far were able to purchase their scrolls with the same spent-time as other classes with other scrolls. I'm not saying because these are unpopular classes therefore this should be overlooked, don't get me wrong but I'm always for the idea of providing everyone equal chance with their character progression. So my question becomes, you're having this problem with Shield for Att 60% but what about Shield for M.Att 60% ? You're saying Shield for Att 60% only coming from Gach is unfair but Shield for M.Att 60% isn't ? In my opinion, same category of scroll with the same % used on the same category of equipment obtainable through same means isn't really one being unfair over the other. I understand where you come from and I too don't think it would have much of an impact if we had more of these scrolls and more of those shields around which would get cheaper in time with more availability and same or slightly higher demand for them. And yes it would make things easier for Shadowers, Paladins and especially Ironmen. I just thought saying "why not" or "why don't we have more of those shields" or "why don't we make it easier for low-tier classes" wasn't a valid reason in my opinion. I honestly don't think much will change if this was implemented, but my point was mostly Ironmen would be happy for this change which is a challenge supposed to be the most hardcore challenge to take on in MapleRoyals. (again not talking Ironmen or you down) That is what I think about this, I hope you can see from where I stand as well. It's okay whether my opinion is an unpopular opinion or not, as this is what I think of this.
Sorry for misinterpreting your message, text can be like that sometimes. I totally see where you're coming from but there is one thing I would like to comment on. Shield for Weapon Att and Shield for M.Att are not the same. It's the same reason Glove for Weapon Att is available and Glove for M.Att isn't. The reason is pretty clear. They give int to the items they scroll. Because hp washing is such an integral part of the Royals meta game, it prevents these items from being more available. It also creates more "jackpots" for gachapon, which is kind of what gachapon is for. If those scrolls just offered only M.Att and not int, mages would be very upset with an arbitrary restriction to their class, like how I feel now. Overall, you made some good points and I appreciate you taking the time to flesh out your arguments. Now I have a pretty good understanding of the opinions from the other perspective. You seem like a pretty cool person, so sorry I came off like a bit of a jerk. As much as I would like to see this change, it wouldn't make very much impact for most of the people playing. Fortunately, It's not a very difficult addition to make. I see this as a low effort, low reward kind of situation from a dev perspective. I think it would add a bit of balance and consistency to the game, but it's nothing huge. I hope I've explained myself well, even if I might be wrong.
At this point in time, I feel like pretty much everything that needs to be said has been said. Both sides of the argument have made great points but I would like to see some GM judgement on the topic. Will this change be considered? Has it already been considered? (Judging by the manual drop table change to Ninja Castle, this seems likely) I've provided lots of information on why I think this is a reasonable addition to the server's drop table, and many others have proposed why it shouldn't. If anyone new has something to say about it, read the thread and continue the discussion. More discussion is more fun!
Seems like a reasonable buff for shield-using classes that are currently considerably underplayed - Paladins, Heroes, and Shadowers. Making it a Temple of time drop would also make a lot of sense since a lot of Paladins&Shadowers grind there due to the elemental bonuses and Shadowers natural grinding style. I'm down for this suggestion, However, there is a need for a more drastic buff to those (Once again, underplayed) classes. It could make more people play those classes and increase the diversity of classes in the server, Which is something I'd love to see personally.
