Why HP washing should not be changed. VERY SIMPLE! LAZY PLAYERS HATE THIS!!!!

Hello.

From what I've seen its mainly NL and BMs complaining about HP washing. And it makes sense. They have the least HP. But it seems everyone has forgotten that they do the most damage.

This is the trade off for that high DPS you guys all want. Everyone wants to be the top damage and white the boss. Again, this is the trade off for doing damage, you have less HP. This is the reason why I believe HP washing is not an issue. It is balanced as it is. NL and BMs can increase their hp pool and make warriors almost unnecessary. Yet, you do not see warriors complaining all the time to buff their damage. Because they understand the trade off for HP is the damage reduction.

Now, that is the reason I think HP washing needs to be the way it is and should not be changed to be made easier.

I'm open to discussing this because I believe the real issue is that people wanna do the damage, but don't wanna put the work for it.

 

The reason I mostly don't like HP washing (Warrior not NL/BM) is that the server is effectively dead. The ratio between people training/pqing to leeching/leechers is way too high. Training to lv135 was a pain, all bishops were leeching, all attackers were getting leeched, everyone is just afk. I don't think this is healthy for the server in the long run.

 

No it definitely isn't. But it is a part of the game and probably always will be. However, with all leech, it costs money. Without a doubt, the characters getting leeched are second or even third characters.

New players can usually not afford leech for long periods.

 

I recruited some new people to our guild and the first thing they do is sell APRs or gacha to buy leech instead of farming/pq since it is not the best way to play the game right now. I think HP washing needs a huge rework. It should definitely not stay as it is as it is tedious, expensive, not fun imo and has almost no nostalgic aspect to it, which is what this server aims for at the end of the day.

 

That makes 0 sense for a new player to do this. Leech is not worth buying until at least level 75 or w/e level it is for Wolf spiders. To get to this level, you end up doing 4 types of PQs.
Im not understanding what you expect though. You want a change, but don't know what kind. I don't think it needs to be changed.

Im assuming you don't want HP Washing at all?
Based on this:

 

Whether is worth or not, as soon as they enter the game they get spammed with smegas selling/buying leech. I think it is normal for them to assume it's everyone's goal to leech. As far as HP washing, I'd like it to be something we don't get rid off, but rather rework. People have suggested quests for hp, or killing bosses for hp. I do not see any reason to not rework it other than old players refusing change because they already spent money on it. Making it so it doesn't cost money but effort would help the economy tons. Less people buying APR's means more gacha, more WS/CS in the market, more items being scrolled and a more active maple society.

 

I like to think that new players are trying to play a nostalgic experience. More than likely, everyone who starts plays the class they think was their favorite. After they learn how the server works, they go and play the way they think everyone else is. I don't actually think people buy leech just because everyone else is doing it. I think they do it because they are lazy. If they are washing, then its because they are washing.

As for making HP wash not require money, I think this would actually be counterproductive to the issue you described and would actually cause people to buy leech more often and for longer periods of time. As a result, more money would be generated through monster drops. There is already so little money sinks in this game that I think it actually makes sense to make AP resets expensive. The economy may or may not benefit from removing AP Resets in general, but this most likely won't happen.

Also HP washing can be 100% free if you put the effort and time into it.

As for bringing in more WS/CS/Gacha items into the game, I think this is actually a negative as well. We don't need to make the game easier to have fun.

 

I don't think it's making the game easier. We don't even know what solution they'd come out with or if it'd cost mesos. I just don't think the way it is right now is good at all. It has nothing to do with players being lazy, since as long as you have mesos, all you have to do is get afk leeched to lv135. It's just boring and takes way too long to accomplish. A solution that'd make players more active and engaged is something I look forward to. Keeping a broken system just because it's challenging is no excuse to not look for alternatives.

 

Listen, I understand your side. I truly do. However, can you please tell me one thing?
In one brief and non complicated sentence, please describe the strongest reasoning you have as to why HP washing needs to be changed. Because from what you are writing, I can't figure out your exact reason.

Is it to encourage a more active experience during low and mid levels? If its this, you should not be concerned with HP washing, more with leeching instead. And I can quickly make a case as to why leeching needs to be changed and how to change it in a way that would benefit most. But thats not the reason I made this thread.

To me, it seems you are upset because the way you play the game is the route least taken. But you cannot get upset because people are not playing the way you expect or think is the correct way.
I honestly do not think HP washing is the reason why there is a void in lower and mid leveling phase.
I think the reason its like this is because the rate we receive genuinely new players does not outpace the rate at which an average player might level.

To put it in perspective, I reached level 43 in two days of playing without leech or PQing. I just quested. (Should be noted this is using an Ironman challenge character). Idk about you, but every time I go to ludi I see people PQing at LMPQ. Its not as much as GMS used to be ofc, but the reason behind it is obvious.

 

I am not upset at all haha. My reasoning is that it greatly contributes to people leeching and people not being active. I have nothing against having high HP but I also see no reason to keep it as is. There is no easy way to buy APR's (NPC selling APRs would be a good money sink), leeching is the most effective way to HP wash (afk players and no pq) and it promotes elitism on bossing (R>HT pm *HP* and range). Even though I don't have to worry much about HP washing. I don't even want to consider making a new character since afk getting leeched to HP wash is not fun for me and training while having 200 base int as a hermit is not very ideal. The unnecessary barrier people want to put on HP washing is killing the player base and hindering the server from growing and it kinda hurts me given how much I like this game and server, maybe that's why it comes off as angry or salty .

 

I can respond to this part as I run ht daily:

the reason why people look for requirements in a HT is not due to elitism (well, most people don't....but i agree that some do however), but rather as the necessity so as to be able to make the run successful.

the hp requirement is to check whether if you are able to survive HT or not, if not the host will decide you will stick to upper platforms during leg phase, or else change the HT strategy to kill wings first / or get a drk into the pt otherwise (since attackers (or good NLs, specifically) are a premium to recruit in HT aft all)

the damage requirement....well, it's to no surprise. Most people want 6k and above range is because... HT itself is a boss that requires 2hrs (strong pts can do 1.5h<) investment into killing with an average pt, and the longer the time drags on taken to kill it, the more likely the run will fail due to lagging/(attack) pot cost/ tiredness, hand cramps, attentiveness dwindling due to overplay etc. I'm not saying you cannot HT with an average range, you can, I personally can take in attackers with acceptable lower range, but this is where the crux is - anyone decent can get 6k range, so long as they are high levelled enough (about 18x-ish++?), and it boils down to 2 factors in this case - you would want to ht at a lower level where people can carry you, or other people in the pt aren't that happy that a lower damage person is able to join the pt with themselves resulting that they have to "apple" more, to make HT be able to be downed in a reasonable time (if not it'll take 3hrs and above, thus resulting in a 'fail' run, wasting a precious ht of their day and yada lada.)

 

It's also cause of this new weapon cancel thing. In old source a weak/below average PT could still kill HT in 2 hours or so but now with the weapon cancel it would take them much longer and wouldn't be a good run

 

100% This ^ I'm assuming most of us are here to play for the 'nostalgia' feeling we had when we played prebb, but with all this hp washing going on, you literally can't train by yourself if you plan to have some high hp goal with a huge base int making you weak af. This is also assuming you would like to boss late game like ht, toad, etc.
Like if CPQ ever came out, no 'new' player would enjoy it because they'd be hp washing and wouldn't be able to do any dmg in it making it boring for them. They'd rather just get their base int up to 140 pre50 and try to get a nice hp goal towards late game. I really wanted to do some kpq/opq/ppq but honestly couldn't find anyone to party up with in those pq's cus everyone is too busy leeching.

Yeah you might be thinking, why not just make a bishop and sell leech for money and remake a NL / BM later? This is exactly what I had to do, I started about 3 weeks ago and created a sin as my first char but had literally no funds to make it after getting it's base int to 140 (didn't think about how I'd do my job advancements with no dmg... took me 45 min to complete my 1st job advancement..) So I had to remake my character as a cleric to attempt to make some money by selling leech. But the problem is, not everyone has the same time they had when they were younger and making / close to maxing 2 characters is really hard with the limited time.

I'm not saying to completely butcher hp washing to the point it's accessible with no work required because yes I agree, it would be unfair to older players. But just to re-work it somehow so that it doesn't literally take 3-6 months of saving up NX daily non stop, making money, etc.

Edit: So I've been reading some more and it sounds like some of the older players are really against this, which I understand. But if something like this were to have changed back in the day when you were a brand new player, I don't think you would have objected to it at all, you were probably all for it.
I see this as a way to welcome future/new players with a sense of enjoying the game for how they remember it and not have to worry about building up, saving, hp washing for 3-6 months straight.

 

Idk, to me nostalgia would be playing without washing, making friends with other lowbies who were on the same path as you, forming PQs adding to BL because you wanted to run party together again. ???? Is that not the nostalgic part of MS? Or did you guys actually enjoy playing the game as if it was a grindfest?

Why is everyone stressing about HP washing and throwing the word nostalgia there. Its pretty clear to me that if I wanted a nostalgic experience, I would not even care about HP washing. If I wanted to get to the content I never got to when I did play, I'd still do it as a newb with no hp washing as if it was my first time because I didn't do it the first time. And finally, after doing all that I would play the game to go bossing with HP washed character maxed gear and try to become a cool kid on the server <-- this is the ultimate goal isn't it huh.

My main point if you dont get it, is theres two ways to play. The try hard way or the casual, nostalgic way. Can't expect to have both because the game has changed since most remember it.

Btw, im not sober atm.

 

I don't think there are any good points as to why to keep HP washing as it is other than "Because its hard and costs a lot of money and time", which makes no sense to me whatsoever. Granted it is not the only problem the server has, but it is a major contributor to the bad state the server is in.

 

Also this is what we aim for when we say rework HP washing. Because it is so hard to accomplish these things having HP as it is in the game right now.

 

but.. but... lazy people!!! /s

Just to further your point, let's compare Royals to GMS...

MapleRoyals gameplay:

• Smega for leech, find mage seller, pay mesos
• Sit on a rope not doing anything until level 135

Original Maplestory gameplay:

• Level up and constantly unlock new skills and gear
• Choose which maps you want to train on and what PQs you want to do
• Meet other players around the game world, form parties, and make friends

Original Maplestory gameplay is objectively more fun...

This discussion has nothing to do with people being lazy. It has to do with wanting to make the game more fun, social, and actually feel like oldschool Maplestory again. Yes, technically HP washing was in the game in GMS. But the difference between washing in Royals and washing in GMS is night and day and has made the game worse, and something should be done to help fix it.

 

But if you want to play this game like the good old pre bb gms, you'll be the minority of the minority. You cant find people easily who wants to do just that due to the MapleRoyals washing/leeching culture.

Ive never bought a single leech in my life. I always self leech so im not one of those "lazy" people. However to be honest, im at a point that it bored me to death doing semi afk holding down a button killing "end game bosses", watching movie, while running multiple semi afk farming/leeching mules.

I attempted to make unwashed characters mnay times to try and "enjoy" playing maple the old fashion way to get away from the brain-dead bossing activities. But when I go to the ch 1 PQ area, it's either complete empty, or there are a few people wanted to pq that cant even get enough people to form a party. If I go to the typical grinding maps, I can cc through all 20 channels and I'll probably find a hacker or botter before I see a legit player training.

It's not right or wrong. This is the MapleRoyals today.

 

I would like to point out that even if HP washing was completely rebooted and wiped off this server, it will still not solve the problem of 'leeching is the most efficient way of levelling up'.

It will still be the best option to level till one is lv 135

 

That is true. Even at lv 18x or 19x, leech is more reliable way to gain exp than zak, krex, or horntail if you do long hours. (ive tested this myself)

However, the lv 135+ community is there. It's so much easier and more fun to find people to play together after you reach 135 than before. You cant find training parties or partners easily like pre BB GMS, so you either leech, or solo grind regardless youre hp washing or not.

The community between 1 and 134 is practically non-existent relatively speaking compares to the size of community post lv 135.

Edit: had to edit a thousand times because I'm sleepy as hell. Missing words and misspelled everywhere lmfao.