HTP Price!

Recently I have noticed some HT runners has been selling VIP HTP price at 600m. My concern is that it would keep decreasing in price and it will be difficult to increase it again. It has dropped from 1b to 800m and now 600m. I strongly encourage HT runners should not keep decreasing the price, as this will benefit HT runners in the long run.

Why price should not drop?
1. Respect of other HT runners

2. HT runners do not profit much from having a 600m VIP buyer

Reasoning: Assumption of an average 1Hr and 20Mins Horntail run, an attacker would use about 4 apples and 40 stoppers or a night lord would use 3 apples and 23 stoppers.

Without alchemist – 4 (apples) x 12m each = 48m, 40 (Stoppers) x 320k = 12.8m
Total cost per horntail run- 48m (Apples) + 12.8m (Stoppers)+ Potion cost (5-15m but let’s just take it at 10m) + 1 Steel/Mithril plate (4m Steel/6m Mithril, total of 10m) = 80.5m.

With alchemist- 3 (apples) x 12m each =36m, 23(Stoppers) x320k = 7.36m
Total cost per horntail run 3 (Apples) x 12m each + 23 (Stoppers) x 320k Potion cost (5-15m but let’s just take it at 10m)+ 1 Steel/Mithril plate (4m Steel/6m Mithril, total of 10m) = 63.36m

If 600m VIP, each person split would be 100m.

Without alchemist of a regular attacker = 100m – 80.5m = 19.5m profit

With alchemist of a night lord = 100m – 63.36m = 36.64m profit

3. Time is important as each horntail run take time to set up, time to run and the effort of recruitment.

Thanks for reading! Hope to hear perspectives from the community and HT runners as well

 

My personal feel goes the same to Chaos Scrolls and White Scrolls. They should have a fixed base price without decreasing. However with the decreasing population... There is a decrease of demand as well... Hence the decrease of the valuability and price... My lousy two cents tho ~

 

That's the nature of a market though. It's going down for a reason, and forcing prices back up when demand is low will only push people to get cheaper alternatives, like MoN, which I suspect is part of the issue, HTP are no longer the only pendant around that's worth literally anything.

The server pop was close to, if not passed, 1k today/yesterday. I don't think its so much a decreasing population as it is people are busy because we're smack dab in the middle of midterms

Also, if I'm not mistaken, the CS/WS prices are close to what they were before new source.

Edit: The bil coins were introduced partially because WS/CS shouldn't have a completely stable price

 

It's simple supply and demand. Similarly to how when there are not as many zak buyers, people try to lower the price at which they sell helms at. When HT first came out in new source, it was 1b because everyone in the server basically needed one. But now that everyone has that, coupled with the fact that cwkpq came out, there's really not much demand for HTP. The people who sell it at 600m are just reacting to the market. They rather make a bit of money to cover their costs rather than to make none at all. That's just my two cents.

 

As more people get into HT-running levels, supply goes up. Demand is not really increasing as not as many new people are coming in and there aren't many people on at the moment, probably until next summer honestly.

Sure you can try to fix the price but people will just get MoN's instead and you will be left running HT with no buyer because no one wants to buy overpriced pendants.

 

How about the exp you get, the 5k NX cards, the rare skill books only available from HT, and the dragon weapons that dropped (gotta be worth smth, look at the recent drama)?

As someone who's not strong enough to run daily HT, my opinion is that the prices of skill books and HTP is finally becoming less ridiculous (again, just my opinion). Also as people above has pointed out, the price is low now due to low demand, which might increase when school holiday kicks in.. although honestly I would rather grind for a better MoN, it's technically free (though you can't go bonus), and you get some exp from doing the bosses too!

 

i'm pretty sure that people usually only care about the exp and the skill books dat drop from ht. selling htp isnt really the main way of profiting from doing ht since most of the time there arent buyers or someone would want to reloot. also AM dun arent forced to go get htp anymore cos of which have the potential of being on par with htp aside from the int > ma crap that no one would care abt cos those AM are never levelling up since they just keep dying and dying to sell leech

 

Prices should be gravitating towards overall market's demand and supply, and should not just remain fixed because other market players can always price lower than the market agreed price point regardless how you want to enforce a common standard or guideline. It will ultimately be dishonored via other informal agreements e.g. privately, with the buyer, setting lower price to gain a price comparative advantage.

Today, with MoN as a substitute threat to the market, fixing a price at the same rate for HTP as prior will just turn even more customers away (to add on, the server is already facing a decline in population).

Otherwise, look elsewhere for source of income.

 

on a serious note, your basic assumptions of the materials used are exaggerated to fit your argument and even then at the worst case scenario (6 members) you are still gaining profit. as everyone said, fixing the market price will not necessarily generate as much income as you'd like considering the other available options there are. With the introduction of MoN, there is a chance for players to obtain an item with equal or greater value than HTP freely and to counteract this, it is plausible that lowering the HTP price will allow an "easier" method at achieving such gear.

please don't twist this story into a show of respect for other runners when you've clearly taken it upon yourself to discredit other sellers that arent adhering to your rules

 

Firstly, this is a discussion, no one is trying to twist story, like you trying to twist into a drama(looks like it when you mention about it at the end of your comment).

Also, we do understand that the market is dead for people to afford/buy the VIP HTPs service, also we understand that there's actually more supplies comparing to the demand of HTPs, especially because of the CWKPQ as people can run for free with group of random people for MoN.

Another but is that HTPs are always a better end game pendant than the MoN, there's a reason why we sell, and people buy the HTPs services, because they can't do it themselves but to buy it. It's the same method as we sell/buy Zakum helms. In this case, people do Zakum runs every single day just like people do daily HT runs, and according to what you say, or we all know, the market is dead, are you going to sell the VIP Zakum Helms for 75m or lower instead of the regular price of 100m because of the market? For the newbies that need Zakum helms, some of them need HB to get it too, as well as the HT, some of them need HB to get in too.

[About MoN]: I personally think that MoN can never reach the value of HTP in stats, unless you're talking about the weapon attack. Also, it requires a hell of a luck to get the good WA of MoN, but instead, you can at least an all-stats of 21/21/21/21 in HTP(with Egg), but that's the lowest, it could be the average of all-stats of 23(28 max with Egg).

Somehow it's a phychological method that when people see one do something, other people might follow. As one try to sell the server at 600m, other people will try to follow too(which most of us don't want it to happen).

It's reasonable to consider about the cost and time we use in the HT runs, we spend at least an hour and half in one single run to complete, unlike a Zakum run can somehow finish in 15mins(depending on the party's range). No matter how "pro" or high your range of your party to run a HT run, we at least need an hour in the cave to finish the whole run(except comparing most of us with the great Fryslan's 25mins run).

Just reminding that this is a discussion that we're trying to see what and how people think about the prices we are doing for the HTPs services we're selling. As HT runners, most of us know each other, let's try to conclude a good solution or price for all of us.

As this topic is about not to lower the HTPs services price anymore. I honestly think 800m for VIP is reasonable, but 600m is a little too low to cover whatever we use in the run(as shyt happens such as party members d/c or died).

 

Hello sids! Please taking another read at the post and comments.
I believe no one is twisting an show of respect, this is a very straightforward discussion thread on how will a HTP be priced, whether is 800mil an good price to remain, adjust it to 600mil? Or bring it down entirely to 400mil.

No one is calling out an “rule” in this area of discussion.

The sink in market and over populating of sellers is definately and a forseable issue of without new players for a good time to come. But seems like there should be a limit to drop of htp prices for a long time to come.
SoonTM S>HTP 50mil S> Zak Helm 100mil

 

its ridiculous to me that you guys still don't believe you're the root cause of any of this drama. every single recent thread that has "guild" members attached to it complaining about an issue is merely an indirect passive aggressive approach at something they think they're able to control.

I beg to differ here. a perfect stat MoN (8 wa/11 stat) is more desirable than a non CS'd perf HTP (28/28) as many of the end game players have tested and agreed upon. I find that players may buy HTP services because at worst the 21/21 HTP is better than the average MoN (2-3 wa) and is much easier to get than running countless CWKPQ runs.

For the zakum helm services you have mentioned, I believe the prices are fine considering the larger distribution of players on the lower end. There is clearly much more demand for Zhelms as it is sought upon as early as level 50 once players have completed their prequests. In relation to the HTP services and what you have said, as demand decreases why should the market for such services remaining the same? It is just basic demand and supply.

Joon, I've been targeted by not only you but many members of "guild" (including OP) about the current HTP prices I sell at. It is obvious why this is not as straightforward as you would want but I am just stating my position and how i've gotten here.

 

Everything in the economy is going down, WS/CS/APR have taken a 40% hit now (500M -> 300M), HTP is a luxury item and will absolutely follow this trend. I would say 600M for HTP would actually be appropriate now that MoN is released, the average Mapler isn't min maxing their character that took years to fund

Its pretty simple economics, if there isn't demand and there is a surplus of supply, the price will continue to fall.

 

a Perfect MoN indeed is more desirable @allanklw and such as 8wa 11luk will be alot better incomparison even a 28luk perfect HTP
But since this discussion is probably more towards End Game Experienced Players/Host that sells HTP,
we probably can come to argue that why is a HTP is always in a better demand then MoN, simply by looking at how strong is it for the new players.

• The larger percentile of HTP buyers, usually are Bishops/Archmages where the require that amount of Int and luk to wear higher level mage gears such as Starlight/Anakamoon and even lapiz to push for 1Hit Petri/Skele after a long farming for mesos @ low level leech.
  And be honest here, for almost 80% of the players, the way to success is by mages. making them actually really sorted out for.
• HTP Will easily be better then MoN because of the secondary stats that almost all classes will need when your unfunded, look at a simple 600/800mil can get you to, wearing those Stonetooth, Craven, and even Nisrocks without any Stats added to base substats.
• They give int subs for any newer lvl120+~ that still require washing.

There are many more reasons why an 22 to all stats will be easily better then MoN, because of it being such an great early game item for almost all classes.
The Demand is dropping yes, but the quality and sheer powerful stats will never be outcasted by an MoN.

How many NLs can successfully equip DPS with Full Attack Gears and still wear a MoN?
At our current v58, without Mulung Dojo Belt and only Alchemist Rings, Not Much.

 

Like i shared above please view this as an Friendly General Community Discussion Post, if the community can come to discuss this issue and accept the prices around wouldn't that solve an issue for you as well?
Simply there isn't knives/Guns Pointed but an wish and hopes of an friendly discussion of an friendly price among sellers that we can come about. Please do not get the wrong idea

 

That's not how an economy works.

 

It might not be but simply undercutting immediately after one player SMega a price doesn't seem to right don't you think?
Host 1 : "S>HTP VIP 800mil"
seconds after,
Host 2: "S>HTP VIP 600mil"

Both hosts are on very friendly terms, and simply asking for an discussion/solution over this issue.

 

Feel like this discussion is based almost entirely off of emotion.

The MoN is absolutely a great substitute for a user to have and can be used until you are able to loot your own from attacking. Along with the community HT runs such as BCHT, there really isn't a reason to buy a HTP unless you are an arch mage.

So far we have:

• Low demand
• Deflation (check out deflation circle )
• On par substitutes (MoN)
• Increased supply (Community HTP runs)
• A lull in the playerbase

Once (if) the economy turns around we could see the price start to climb back up, however, I don't think services tend to recover like items do. Who knows

 

there is no issue here lol, if people don't want to follow the trend of the market then they risk losing their share. no one is forcing any sellers' hands at maintaining their price for the service.

 

This is called the free market. I'm sure the whole party would have discussed it beforehand. The buyer has the right to choose which seller to buy from. It could just be the team takes longer so tell sell lower. I don't see a point to having this discussion. If u wanna sell higher then go ahead. But there's no point to "discussing" about this lowering of prices since they do have the right to sell lower if they wish to.