Hey guys, since the "Buccaneer Class Feedback" thread is closed i want to start a feedbackthread about the actuall changes for Buccaneers. I am a little bit speechless because i have read many good comments in that Buccaneer Class Feedback-thread. Now we got a good but simple damagebuff overall to mess up with other classes and an infinitely usage on transform. We got no crit or immunitis against stun/knockback. Stance still run out and our mobility didnt change. Att buffs from transform or energyshield included. Welp okay we got at least more damage and i think that is what we wanted to be buffed! Pew pew But i am still a little bit scared...really scared...at the point i have readed the patchnotes it run coldy down at my neck.. The reason why i ve felt so is simple. I started a bucc because of a few things. -not populär -timeleap -more viable attacks -transformations -barrel -partybuff si ! -ez to wash You had many 4th job SP that are pretty usefull!!! For example a Nl or a Mage just have like 2-3 usefull 4th job skills +mw+heroswill. At 150 skilling becomes borred and feels useless...(my opinion) As buccaneer its not! 30 for Barrage 30 for Dragonstrike 30 in Demolution 30 in Timeleap 20 for Si 20 for Transformation 20 in Mw 5 for pirates rage Snatch is optional and not so recommend like energy blast too. Anyways that makes 185 usefull points i like to skill in! Level 182 !!!! Gocha Bucc is allready Op! With the cooldownless transformation i thing Ds and Barrage arent such as usefull anymore. Sure zarkum, cwkpq etc. it could be better.... But its not so recommed to skill ds+barrage+demolution+ transform to get your most damagevalue. I like the usage of both. Barrage plus Ds and when cd ready is, i gonna rage my demolution in that creepsface for a damagepeak. Dont missread me i like barrage + Ds combo really much but now i have to use demolution in most ways and two cooldowns fewer. I dont want to look like an NL... Just stay and smash one attack. I like to be able a meele and a range class. Yea yea i am still able i know, but who uses attacks that deal less damage when having a stronger one ready to go... Forever In my opinion is the flat damageboost good enough. We will have good damage with barrage plus Ds and demo when rdy. Further is movementspeed limited by the mount. The change of infinity transform wouldnt change it unless the flat speed would be set higher. 150-170 as an example. At bosses we have haste. Otherwise we use Tprock or mount. I even use it on grinding. Overall i am hyped how fast i could kill Bf now and happy to be able to white some zarkumarms or ht-wings. Hopefully we got an free SP reset, to renew my priorities for skillpoints. Please write down your experiences with the new patch. I will selftest the new patch soon. Maybe i have missthink about some things so dont judge me at all I am a critically thinking person and just try to see things different. Greetings Mia
Super transformation was perma in I believe Old-Source and I believe it was deemed too op and was removed. Buccs like Dre used to solo BFs in like 1-2mins with Demo spam. I think the super trans buff was too much. I believe Buccs needed a buff but not in this direction. Outside of mobbing boss summons (which most DPS ignore anyways), I do not see a purpose of using Barrage/DS/Regular Transformation/ anymore. It feels like Bucc gameplay has been dwindled down into a melee NightLord as they proceed to hold down one button and rebuff their "shadow partner" every few minutes. @Al3x was the first bucc I partied with when I started. It was mind boggling how he was zakking while flying around using Cork/backspin to reposition on zak arms and DS/Barrage Combo I had thought they would help bucc by allowing the critcs to work/buff DS/Barrage combo. When we got our MM buff they tweaked Strafe damage. It really helped MM's who were good at their strafe/snipe rotations. Feel like the more experienced buccs would dislike this buff overall. What could've been a better stance/cleaner DS+Barr/Critc chances buff.
I think super transformation only needs 1Point for the entire duration. Extra points only increase Magic Def (it used to lower cooldown). Demolition is a specific amount of attacks. Buccs don't even benefit off their own SI anymore lol. You can put +1 SuperT and +30 Demo and probably not need any other skill (with the exception of maybe Pirates Rage) since none of them actually help you boss better (MW can be provided from party members).
This is a change that defeats the playstyle of Buccaneer -- to utilise different skills from first to fourth job when the situation calls, taking note of the cooldowns of transformations and maximise the Time Leap efficiency to ensure longer duration of transformation and even refresh the party's skills' cooldown when needed. Although I don't play Buccaneer, I remember how many of them mourn over the changes and quit immediately when that octopunch thingy was introduced to replace both barrage and demolition and it wasn't a good sight to see. Yes, they get the much needed damage boost but they have their representative identity wiped...and this is what Big Bang had done pretty much, which shouldn't be happening in a Private Server that is advertised to be nostalgic. So hopefully this will be reverted at some point of time (hopefully soon) and some other improvements could be introduced instead without disrupting the Buccaneer's identity in a huge extent, though the Buccaneers themselves have to voice out their opinions as well.
Spoiler: Spoiler of Buccanner's original post Hi it's me. I will reiterate what I have suggested years ago, but I'm glad to see this in a bit more of the forefront of suggestions. A 12k range bucc is similar to a 6.5k range NL. That means that a NL can use Lucky7 and do the same damage as a bucc, which means NL are 50% stronger than buccs. That being said, I think the core of the buccaneer class should be the same: same iframes and attack speed and skills. I've seen a lot of suggestions over the years from shortening skill delays, to changing the speed of knuckle weapons, to adding critical damage. Why I believe each of these suggestions is not a very good quality of life change for the buccaneer 1. Shortening skill delays, changing speed of knuckle weapons Shortening skill delays The buccaneer class in pre-bb has been know to have iframes. Those are certain timeframes in which the class cannot get hit after using skills. An example would be using barrage or corkscrew punch. Both skills have a set amount of time that no mob attacking skills can hit the player. By changing and shortening skill delays, this would inherently change the iframes of the class (I would assume making them shorter). While I can't be for sure about this, it also would not have a huge impact to the class. The skill delays of the buccaneer class are quite long. Here are the delays of barrage + dragon strike and demolition Since buccaneers hit Faster 2 with their Fast 5 knuckle (-2 booster, -2 speed infusion, capping at faster 2), you can see that the delays are significant unchanged. Barrage + dragon strike takes a total of 2,910 ms to complete and demotion takes 2,340 ms to complete. If you want a 10% increase in damage to all 3 skills, you can see how much delay needs to be removed. For the barrage+DS combo, that is 291 ms removed for a 10% increase in DPS. And for demolition, that is a 234 ms change. Just looking at demo and the change in delays for each speed, each speed is ~210 ms, so adding a 10% increase in damage would be about 1 speed difference. Changing the speed of knuckles to faster 1 I don't think that's even possible with the game design. Even if it is, you can see that it won't even be a 10% increase in damage for barrage+DS or demolition. A pretty small change that won't effect the buccaneer much. 2. Adding criticals to buccaneers (passive or skill wise) Adding crits to buccs makes the class reliable on SE for any sort of DPS. This is like the NL effect where NLs feel "useless" in a boss run without SE because of their massive decrease in damage without SE. Passive crit or crits with a skill on a bucc will massively boost bucc damage since it stacks with SE. This may be good for their overall damage but then they are much more reliant on an archer class to provide SE for them. This just changes the feeling of the bucc instead of a supporting class, to a class that is needy of SE. Although it's not a terrible idea, it would change the way buccaneers play and feel since their damage will seem like it solely comes from their need for SE. Suggestions The best way to change the buccaneer class's damage without changing the fundamentals of the class is simply tweet the numbers of their main damaging abilities. I am also supporting barrage having an increased range (to be able to hits arms in HT). Barrage + dragon strike damage increase Barrage currently does 230% x 10 and dragon strike does 810%. That means that barrage is 2300% at 1830 ms delay + dragon strike 810% at 1080 ms delay (assuming dragon strike hits 1 mob). Totaling it up, that is 3110% damage at 2910 ms. I don't think dragon strike needs an increase in damage. It is still a strong mobbing ability and in training, it is very viable. That means that barrage should only be the skill that is changed since it is a 1v1 ability. To increase the overall damage by 20%, which I think is a nice change: 3110% * 1.2 = 3732% Subtracting the difference between new and old, we get 3732 - 3110 = 622% total Putting that percentage directly into barrage = 622% / 10 = 62.2% increase in each barrage hit. Since that is an odd number, round down to 60% instead. Barrage going from 230% currently to 290% will give a final boost of DPS from barrage+ dragon strike combo of: 290% * 10 + 810% = 3710% (3710 - 3110)/3110 = 19.3% DPS increase Pretty fair I think. Demolition Let's first compare how much more DPS is demolition than barrage+DS. Barrage+DS = 3110% @ 2910 ms. Demolition is 400% * 8 @ 2340 ms = 3200% @ 2340ms. Quick maths: (2910-2340)/2910 = 19.6% faster skill. 3200% * 1.196 = 3827%. This means if demo was as slow as barrage, it would do 3827% or about 23% more DPS. With the cooldowns of supertransform (240 seconds and it lasts for 120 seconds), that means that 1/2 the time you will be barrage+DS and the other 1/2 of the time will be using demolition. To give an average increase of about 20% of OVERALL DPS of the bucc, that means that demolition's DPS would also have to be increase a little less than 20%. With that in mind, let's do the math: 20% damage increase: 3200% * 1.2 = 3840% change of % damage divided by 8 hits of demo: (3840 - 3200) / 8 = 80% If we add 80% increase in demolition, it would give an overall increase in demolitions DPS by 20%, which i think is fair. Scaling wise, this may be harder since decimals are used, so instead we may need to change this total to 90%. This gives us a new DPS: (400+90) * 8 = 3920% (3920 - 3200) / 3200 = 22.5% DPS increase The most viable way to increase demolition by ~20% is adding 90% damage to its skill. I think this is fair. How to practically implement it with proper scaling: Barrage OLD Level 1: 94% + 4% per level Level 10-11 and 20-21: +14% for those specific levels Level 30: 230% NEW Level 1: 94% + 6% per level Level 10-11 and 20-21: + 16% for those specific levels Leve 30: 290% Demolition OLD Level 1: 90% + 10% per level Level 10-11 and 20-21: +20% for those specific levels Level 30: 400% NEW Level 1: 90% + 13% per level Level 10-11 and 20-21: +23% for those specific levels Level 30: 490% TL; DR CONCLUSION Increase barrage from 230% -> 290% and demolition from 400% -> 490% to increase buccaneer's overall DPS by an average of 20%. Increase barrage range to be able to hit HT arms. I have a bit more to say but this was written kind of hastily. My core points of the two skills that should have it's damage increase to increase the buccaneer's overall DPS by ~20% is 90% of what I have to say. Thanks for reading (if you actually read) and hopefully my math is correct. I don't main buccaneer in Royals but i know the playstyle of one. I will give a unbiased 3rd party view in lieu of the recent bucc buff. I quoted @Buccaneer original post as i believe it's the most well-rounded proposal as it keeps the playstyle/nostalgia for Bucc class TLDR; >> flat damage boost + transform with CD + longer energy charge If you find my point/post helpful, do upvote so that the Admins can see and consider it. Problems of Bucc After buff (in point forms, short and sweet) Spoiler: Spoiler 1. TL contradicts itself as a bucc skill since transform has no CD and it's only for Self echo/party Skill 2. Barrage is essentially less useful/useless as you can add 1 point into super transform and max demo for perma demo gaming 3. No more/less usage of barrage+DS combo due to transform with no CD 4. Bucc lose their uniqueness with barrage+DS combo attack when transform is on CD. It has become mainly transform + 1key demo gaming for optimal DPS [it's as if Sair's boat have no CD, and rapid fire will then be obsolete] Some suggestion (in point forms, short and sweet) Spoiler: Spoiler 1. Flat damage boost for both Barrage and Demo % damage [this helps to retains bucc original playstyle] Spoiler: Spoiler 2. Barrage range increase so it can hit HT arms and other bosses 3. No passive crits for bosses, or it will cause heavy dependency on SE like NLs 4. Instead of making transform with no CD for mobility, i suggest to have longer energy duration when fully charged. 5. I find Buccaneer's post most well-rounded and on point personally. So do scrutinize it again for more insights
So, I dun play a bucc myself. But to me it always seemed like, that the fact that you can utilize different skills as a Bucc is the reason why people play it, right? I have the feeling that this playstyle is basically gone now. Because let's face reality, Super Transformation + Demo is the way to achieve your highest dmg output, so people will go for it. While I can see that the Barrage + DS combo is a viable option for farming, I don't think that it is a good argument to say you can Zak with it, because thats 1 boss and you won't rly do that boss anymore once you got a decent helm. I also assumed Super Transformation's duration would be depending on it's lvl now? But it seems like 1 point already gives you the max duration, so there is no need to put any more into it. Super Transformation's duration scales with higher lvl, so all good. SI aint relevant for Demo, or what do you mean? So another skill got useless for a Bucc now? To me it seems like you can skill Demo + 1 point in super transformation and got your core skills at 131, instead of lvl 18x what it used to be before. On another sidenote I am a bit worried about it's power at BF now, because I know you could kill BF in like 5min on a 140-150 Bucc with mediocre gear before (using stopper + mw20 + echo). I assume after the buff and due to perma Trans + Demo this can be done in like 2 min now? For comparison a 8k+ range NL at lvl 200 needs like 5-6min for a BF kill. LF> @Chiffon to test how fast you can down BF now Juz my 2 cents, enjoy your day!
Yup! Demo should be 8 fixed attacks at max with iFrames unaffected by SI. And lvling Super trans should only give you increased magic resist now
If they want to keep this playstyle where transforms have no cooldown, they need to buff bucc's mobbing skills, like Dragon Strike, even further so that buccaneers have an effective mobbing potential in boss runs like Zakum arms and Shaolin. Right now, dragon strike (900% dmg) doesn't hit hard enough to match Hero's brandish or DrK's Crusher mobbing capability even tho it hits 6 mobs. Maybe when it's changed, bucc can use Barrage+DS when there are mobs around the boss and Demolition when no mobs around so they are good at not only single target but also multi target as well? Another suggestion is to buff energy orbs. Energy orbs has been such an underutilized mobbing skill for quite some time. I wished something would be done to it to prevent it from being unused. (Maybe 1000% or more dmg when maxed?)
Nice that many people feels like me So what class do we main buccs play now ? Swap to paladin or shadower? Or just play our overpowered and lame buccaneer further? I think i could even start a Nl then because of alchemist and flashjump... Something have to change. And something is that we want our cooldown on transformations back... This patch doesnt seems like an balanceupdate. Buccs are a little bit broke now with a high potion of getting borred... Wasnt to hart to balance since we got many good ideas of buffing our buccs. Now they broke and lame Without a Sp reset i wont have any advantage from this patch. You made 3 skills useless I maxed 2 of them allready... Edit 4 useless skills now and i maxed 2 and the half of that other skill... That makes 71 points i wont pay 71 sp resets even at 50% discount...i am not rich.. In sadness Mia
Pls dont be so rude to me when i am pretty sas about changes... I was so hyped... Ps i would never start a Nl Quitting is an option. Or shadow/paladin they are cool and have a flexible playstyle too instant of afk attacking Like the new buccs now. @Tim 50% discout on sp reset seems not fair since last time there was a change a spreset was happen... I didnt remind what classes it was i think hero... But they got an Sp reset for like nothing. Bucc is now completly changing and need an Spreset with a highly prefer in my mind
Yea that wasnt a big change and they get spreset .... We have an big change. I skilled 71 complete useless points... Better could use them to maxout TL, Demolution and Mw20
I would like to add that at the feedback thread for Bucc, when GM Luna asked for feedback regarding using consumables for infinite transformation, it was met with mostly objections with reasons pretty much the same above (destroys playstyle, useless skills, etc) but this change was done anyways. Pretty sure we all love buffs so we can all try to catch up to broken lord so huge thanks for the changes, but kinda feels like those several pages of discussion did not amount to much (esp for paladin feedback, so many ideas but only ele weakness added)
