Let's discuss: do you think this deserves an unban?

thats nice and all but sexual harassment & misogyny are still wrong

 

I get the whole harassment thing with 48 hours but I was in discord talking about this: WHAT ABOUT ADDING A SEXUAL HARASSMENT OFFENSE AS WELL :/ with no time limit. I really thought you would do something along the lines of this. This kinda disappoints me.

 

Yes it is.

 

sorry walls of text and screenshots dont matter here even though they may seem impressive at first, + i have a badly edited screenshot of you admitting to ban evading so needless to say your appeal is denied.

 

This is not the same report. He did not serve his ban regarding sexual harassment. This is a separate offense between two different people who happened to have mutual connections. This particular instance involves Sharon and Raony, not Raony and Shin. You are once again covering for your friend. You did not ever make a quick post to explain this on his ban appeal, you did not attempt to contact me via Discord as I waited for your response. You told me *nothing* would change your mind, and you accused me of throwing a tantrum. I'm disappointed in you, and despite people chiming in for 21 pages, you had nothing new to add from when you guilt tripped all of staff. If multiple parties want to get each other banned, let them be. You don't get to chime in because you're friends with them and happen to have a "veto power" as an admin. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

You should have let him ban appeal like the rest of us would have had to.

 

y

you stayed up all night and day for this? embarrassing to say the least.

 

yo June you're awesome thanks for actually responding to my bananapeal. I have no doubts that if you were an admin things would have gone differently. This server doesn't deserve you, but all that will change when Shin buys it and tim gets the axe along with everything hes ever worked on

 

While I appreciate being able to gain a better understanding on how we got to this point and the history between Sharon, Shin and Raony, I don't think this entirely invalidates her report. I think we should be focusing on the bigger picture, Raony's attitude. This doesn't change the fact that he replied to June in a condescending and a misogynistic manner as seen here:

While Sharon could be possibly reporting for revenge, I don't think we should forget his attitude on this thread and in fact, his attitude replying to June should not be overlooked.

We should not ignore toxic behavior just because this report was based on what could be a twisted narrative.

 

He served his ban regarding racist remarks and vulgarity. How is that the equivalent to staff denouncing sexual harassment?
Stop with this false information. You made a mistake and you refuse to admit that you've abused your power as an admin.

 

my first language is portuguese and my parents likewise, that is no excuse and shameful to all portuguese speaking people as first language. This kind of tone so wrong and we dont accept you. Dont take this fraud as truth.

 

Solid response, Tim. I sincerely apologize for insulting your girlfriend; it was entirely unnecessary and uncalled for given she had no involvement with this thread. I respect you sticking to your guns despite the fact that I feel it’s unfair how you’ve invested so much time into this instance of faux harassment while investing much less into other cases that resulted in permanent bans. For the sake of fairness and consistency I feel the level of effort and investigative work should be consistent among all “harassment” appeals and not just high profile ones. Hop into a voice call with others who are/were/get banned for petty nonsense and hear their side, too. The entire approach to harassment bans needs a rework from my perspective — players shouldn’t have words they used X months/years ago influencing their current day punishment (have them ‘expire’ after X months or even annually). I can find middle ground in punishing them with the 3/7/30 day bans when they occur, but I don’t find it to be reasonable how somebody can commit one language offense annually and after 3 years they would be permanently banned. I feel each instance would warrant a 3-7 day ban, and should it continue to occur over a short duration (say 90 days) then it would stack and go up to 30, a permanent ban, etc. Verbal offenses are minor and almost always do not impact the server but rather just one individual. A player who uses mean words on occasion can be having a positive impact on the server overall, unlike somebody who is hacking, RWTing, etc. and removing them permanently would actually be a detriment to the community whereas removing a hacker or RWTer is always a benefit to the community.

I’m looking at the major positive that’s come from this: hyper sensitive players leaving/quitting, the most sensitive and emotionally driven GM is no longer on the staff team, and a normal player in Raony is still allowed to play. All in all it’s a good result for the server long-term. Let’s work to get rid of all of these social justice fairies over time; don’t let them victimize themselves any longer and they’ll run away to find a *~*safe space*~* elsewhere.

 

Thats why he got banned for 3 days.

All what was shown to us from the game is the thing that got him banned for 3 days. Do we really want to ban people in game for what they said/did to each other on discord? Ofc you can think about him whatever u want, if he's annoying in any way, you can ignore him/remove from discord or guild. If you feel sexual harassed, go to the police and make a report, but dont expect that private server admin should ban someone for saying/doing bad things somewhere else than server itself.

 

Raony was only banned with evidence from in-game chats. We charged him with a 2nd offense of harassment, not doxxing.

 

this dude basically defended his friend and tried to change the topic and you think its a good response? how come players have been banned for far less while someone like him is allowed to still play? we are calling out favouritism. lets be honest. all you have to do is to be close to an admin then you can do whatever you want. if you fail to see how true that is then you havent been on royals for a long time lol
favouritism was always alive in royals even in 2016

 

Your parallel runs poor. Each player of this story is from a different country, there's no "go to the police" option that's feasible or realistic. The analogy you provided would be the police being the private server administration/staff(police) to regulate behaviors that go against their ToS (Laws).

Just because the medium is different doesn't make the actions taken any less serious.

To your "just ignore him 4Head" commentary, women experience unwanted attention and harassment in various forms in life, including video games. Trust me when I say most of them mastered "ignoring it" as best as they can more than we can ever criticize them for.

 

It's crazy how one side can complain about blatant misogyny/sexism while at the same time being blatantly racist towards a person of color. Both parties involved should reflect on this and learn to grow up. Racism and sexism are both disgusting and you should all be ashamed for participating in such an affair.

 

And yet all offending parties are banned for the reports that were made against them. Raony did file against racist remarks which led to Shin's ban. Was that not clear to you?

 

I don’t feel that safe playing the server as a female anymore if I know I’m not going to feel supported when a sexual harassment case comes up. This is pathetic, do something more about this and apologize and step down or just leave. AND IF ANYTHING WHY ARENT THE REST OF THE STAFF MAKING HIM WALK THE PLANK LOL

 

I sure hope you are not referring to me since I am one of those complaining about blatant misogyny and sexism, but I'd like to make it clear that I've never said it was okay for people to be blatantly racist towards a person of color. In fact I've never said my friends' behaviors were even acceptable. I've only argued for bans for both sides. So please stop generalizing everyone who is complaining about the misogyny/sexism.

There are people here who complained about misogyny/sexism who weren't even involved in the guild spat.

 

I'm going to start this post with this very simple statement. On a fundamental level, your argument and the entire premise of this post & defense is flawed, tone deaf, and outright appalling. Beyond that, it doesn't actually dig into any of the criticisms being levied in a substantial way. With that said, let's dig into this.

First of all, let's cover the incredibly obvious. On a fundamental level, people are responsible for the things they say and do. This server's general policy towards even joking remarks of various offences makes this very clear; I think it's reasonable to claim that staff have a general stance that they can't reasonably and accurately judge the context surrounding everything people say, so it's generally taken at face value. That's why stuff like memeing about buying a PAC for 4000 Chicken McNuggets or whatever is something that'll get looked at; it's much simpler to just make a blanket ban on it than deal with the people who claim they were "just kidding".

On a fundamental level, treating situations like this is a matter of practicality. It attempts remove biases by simply taking things literally, and minimizes time wasted on arguing intent, something that cannot be factually discerned. You can speculate it, you can infer it, but you can't actually know, all you know is what was actually said and done.

With all this in mind, why does the reason someone reported something matter? The person did not obligate whoever they're reporting to say and act as they did. If you're concerned about people keeping leverage for blackmail, institute a rule about blackmail, but based on the response it seems very clear that isn't the situation. If previous consensus is that intent cannot be used as a reasonable metric, why did you just spend a massive post effectively giving context to try and slander and determine the intent of the person doing the report? You even acknowledge in this very post that, yes, the reported content would constitute harassment. But given previous staff rulings and responses to bans, how is it even fathomable that any of this even matters? Even if the victim had some kind of mastermind big brain plan or bad intent in the report, why does it matter? And more importantly, why does intent and context matter so much for this one report you have to pull out a massive post just to try and maneuver people into believing the reporter had ill intent? What makes this case different from literally anything else? Can you say, in good faith, that if the person being reported here was anyone other than your friend, that you would bother doing all this?

No, obviously not. I've seen no reason to believe that treating a report like this, where you carefully measure intent and put forth everything you can to delegitimize, minimize and attack the intent of the reporter as opposed to the content of the report is standard. In fact, quite the opposite; it seems there's a concerted effort to not worry about the intent of the person who broke the rules, because it can't be determined for certain, and arguing about such things does nothing but waste time and stir drama.

I'm going to be frank. The way I see it, this post is nothing more than a thinly veiled attack on the credibility of the reporter, since there isn't really anything that can defend the contents of the actual harassment itself. It's completely inexcusable for an admin to go through this much effort to defend someone who, by his own admittance, did in fact do something wrong, just because he believes they didn't report something with the purest of intent. Boohoo.