This is MapleRoyals' Promising Imperative?

I stumble on illogical and irrational things everyday of my life as a programming/economics/business student; and this new change makes up for me not having class today.

So let me break down the main points made in John's most recent thread.

So let's start with the idea that decreasing the server rates makes the server more enjoyable.

Why? Decreasing the server rates does not add any new features to the server, it does not give players any incentive to want to do things they wouldn't have done previously, instead it restricts casual gamers from attaining a level or point in the game where they can experience all the features of the game. This essentially leaves everyone except hardcore gamers, fighting boars and slimys and doing PQs every single day, while the hardcore players monopolize bosses and enjoy the end features of the game.

It makes the server far less enjoyable as it forces players to grind for 2.5 hours for every 1 hour they would have spent grinding in order to experience more aspects of the game. So if it took me 10 hours to get to level 50, now it will take me 25. That is not the definition of enjoyable.

The enjoyable aspects of the game come with new features, lowering the exp rates make the game exponentially less enjoyable as all it does it require players to do more boring shit (grinding) before they can experience the well thought out new feature called NOTHING.

Competitive

I honestly can't imagine how this conclusion was made.

Before
Player A receives 10x exp
Player B Receives 10x exp

10/10 = 1

After
Player A receive 4x exp
Player B receives 4x exp

10/10 = 1

The ratio wasn't changed.

But here's the bad part because the rate of leveling depends on more than just the exp rate.
Let's assume that bishops now take 1 hour to level alone, and non-mages take 3 hours; this is not accurate to any number but this is for the sake of argument.

Before at 10x

Level 150 Bishop = 1 hour to level
Level 150 Non-Mage = 3 hours to level

After at 4x

Level 150 Bishop = 2.5 hours to level
Level 150 Non-Mage = 7.5 Hours to level

This is a 1 hour differential transformed to 5 hours. The ratio does not change, it is simply multiplies creating a greater differential within the results.

1 is now 2.5.
so 2 is now 7.5.

Let me make it even simpler. I get 1 apple for every 3 you get. You get 3 apples a day. After 10 days I have 10 apples and you have 30.

What's happened now is that you get 7.5 apples a day and I get 2.5 apples. After 10 days I have 25 apples and you have 75. So now, the difference between me and you after 10 days isn't 20, it's 50.

So if there was any ounce of logic, you can see that lowering rates make the server LESS competitive and gives Bishops (and mage based classes) an even GREATER advantage making the gap even larger. They have 50 (!) more apples after 10 days now rather than having only 20 more apples.


Overall better experience

Now it's obvious that words are just being thrown out in order to persuade players because this doesn't even quantify to anything.


The next issue is the Gachapon/Gullivera revamp which was an atrocious failure as many had warned.

Yes, your determination is accurate, you finally learnt that you cannot change an entire economic system without expecting a failure of adaptation, and a huge amount of people capitalizing and creating a HUGE margin between the upper and lower class; welcome to modern civilization. This revamp however could have been better dealt with by reverting back to the old system and allowing the law of averages to correct itself out.


It is not explicable as to why a wipe and entire exp rate etc reshaping was made because of this. Furthermore, this new server model has only worsened the gap between players on an intrinsically fundamental level (I described all this above).

Some times it is smart to hang your rope and listen to a logical analysis of the inherent failures you are tacking to yourselves.


Lastly

The last thing I'd like to say is that this new change is MapleRoyals completely failing their loyal player base and losing the core on which it was founded on.

This is not incentive, this is throwing a dog a bone and hoping he comes back tomorrow. I warned but it was put to the side; I'm sure many have warned but it was also brushed aside and look where this server is now? If there's one thing you can at least do for yourself it's put your pride aside and realise that what you are experiencing is called TUNNEL VISION and it happens to the best; everyone needs another perspective. You have lost a lot of credibility as a professional server with all this, don't let your egos continue to bring your demise; I've seen the ups and downs of the best servers for 5 years now.

Goodluck fellas, I'll enjoy seeing how this unfolds.

 

If you don't like it, we're not forcing you to stay here and play. You clearly sound very upset about the changes, but you know what, we're doing something right. Why do I say that? Because everyone swore we wouldn't have anybody playing after the wipe and at 7AM local time, there's 30 people online. Pre-wipe, I saw about 35-40 people online at this same time.

Also need to look at our rankings. We're currently 7th in the GTOP100, EXACTLY where we were ranked post wipe and oh yeah, the gtop100 ranking was reset several hours ago so these votes are all post wipe.

I understand not everyone likes the changes but to insinuate that we're burning ourselves alive (my choice of words, not yours I know) is simply unfounded.

 

I haven't played for over a month. I enjoy coming here and looking around and that's my right.

You cannot take a sample right on the relaunch of your server after a wipe and say you've done something right; the fact that there was a wipe shows that something went wrong. This sample which you are talking about is going to be extremely skewed for obvious reasons; people come to the fresh server and play trying to be the best, let's be realistic, it won't last and it definitely won't be as strong a community as it was before the wipe for the reasons I put in my thread.

Firstly, I am not insinuating if I made a thread telling you that you are "burning" yourself. I don't think you know what the word insinuate means.

It is founded, this thread itself is that foundation; if you cannot give an appropriate rebuttal to what I'm saying, that's fine, but how can you say it's unfounded if I just made a whole thread founding my entire argument to you.

The fact is, you did not respond to a single core argument or point I made in this thread; why? Because you know I am right and there really isn't anyway to refute pure logic; this is what I love about X and O. If you don't want a realistic negative feedback regarding something you've done, well it's not my forum, but if you want to keep this an open forum then you need to accept negative feedback and accept that you can't always be right. Every business/company makes mistakes, it's bad trying to save face with straw man arguments.

Again, I wish you all the best, I am giving you feedback and my experienced and educated opinion which is telling you that the direction this server is heading in is not a good one. I was right the last time and that's obvious because look at us now? Testing v83 like I said would happen, wiping due to a complete economic mess up like I said would happen, and trying to change the server because it was boring, like I said it was. You're not doing it the right way.

v62 is hard enough to work with.

Read my thread again before you hit another wall.

You have heavily regressed.

Stop regressing. Move forward. Take negative feedback, don't tell me everything is better now when you all know it isn't. This is a bad gamble.

 

Rates are always arguable, the way you seem to think 20x would have been better than 10x. And even if not, still arguable whether 10x is better than 20x.

But what matters the most is the difference between the players. The rates are still high enough to enjoy, even 1x rated servers have been proven to be good enough for that. And since the server was just wiped it'll definitely be more competitive than before. On top of that 200 level player not being there to take little boys wishes away will keep them racing when they see the spot being open.

What comes to items, by lowering the huge supply of gacha items back to a reasonable amount, the items will actually be worth something again, meaning scrolling will be much more rewarding with a bigger potential of satisfaction. Not having the easily achieved end-game items through the servers early problems will keep the competition for the gear making open as well, fair and thus more enjoyable.

So in many ways more competitive.

The problems couldn't have been controlled better by just "getting the problem back in the game". It would have made it more equal between players, but that is all. It would have eaten the life out of this server multiple times faster in that aspect. Now, for the casual players that might not have been a problem, but for the rest it would have mattered. When we are only getting casual players to stay we are losing a lot, and while the top players are left with nothing to do, and the new competitive players are demotivated, both due to the problems from before, the server will start bleeding out players.


The differences between jobs are well known in maple, and also a part you've always had to live with in pre-bb versions. Though now with lower rates I'm guessing the 1x effect activates, meaning the enjoyability will mean more in the long run. And also due to the extra time it takes to gain levels, attackers will have good enough equipment earlier level-wise for them to be able to party with another attacker and compete, with the aid of bosses, with the 14.5 skeles/per spawn average of 1 hit ko'ing bishop.


Wiping obviously isn't to everyone's liking but the server had many problems that had already done too much destruction when looking at how young the server was. Wiping to a higher version had in the end too many flaws as well even though it would have had more content, so wiping to a lower rated v62 that will be given extra content later on seemed to be the best bet.

 

So you rather having 35 people online than 80-120?

 

You're not making sense.

 

Quality over quantity any day. Yes.

 

The problem with you is that you don't understand we were already losing people because of the fact that this server is too easy. I for example stopped playing because the challenge was taken away from me. Now with the changes I decided to come back. Your opinion is cute and all that but you're using your opinions like they're facts saying ''is not'' rather than ''in my opinion'' which is something you might want to start using since obviously not everyone agrees with the TO.

 

I think it's a little too soon after the wipe to be be able to say this with any confidence. At the moment, the more competitive players are pumped up with adrenalin, as tends to happen at the start of any server: new beginnings, the chance of claiming the top spot as their own, even if only for a little while, the thrill of being the first on the server to have a particular weapon, all that good stuff.

I suspect that only time will tell whether or not this really was the right decision - let's see how things go after the initial spurt of enthusiam and excitement has begun to peter out.

I never thought I'd say this, but right now, I feel torn between being glad we stuck with v.62 and wishing we'd been able to switch to v.83. There's a lot I don't like about v.83 but at the same time, there was a greater variety of things to do. I can understand the reason why we didn't move to v.83, with so many bugs to be tackled, but yea... mixed feelings right now, let's see how things go.

 

Blink I agree with you on a lot of points and disagree on some others.

I agree about rates, "better experience", and how John really isn't replying to your thread. (Did the same to me, he told me to take time to do things when I specifically said I didn't have the time.)

But I disagree about competitiveness. With the wipe everyone has to start from scratch, making it a more competitive environment. Obviously casual players, like myself, will be left in the dust with a harder time catching up (because of rates) but it will be more competitive at first. But I think after the more hard-core players get higher and higher it will be easier for them to hold a competitive advantage over new/casual players because of the EXP curve. New players will have a harder time catching up in levels and economically.

I started just a couple weeks ago and made over 100mil just through casual play. Sure, people had MUCH more but I had enough to fund myself fairly well and the rates were enough to catch up in level. Catching up in level means more opportunities to make money, more opportunities to make money means more balance. 4x EXP will create a larger gap between hard-core and casual players in the future.

 

The only reason you were 7th was because you guys paid for premium, which gives you 100 votes at the start of the month for those who do not know. You managed to hit 2k votes without premium with 80-120 players on constantly. I wish you the best in attempting to maintain that spot with just 30-40 active players.

In reality, you have only gained 34 votes as of 10:58 am EST

Let me add that you only saw 30-40 people online pre-wipe was because you have already announced a wipe and people did not wish to make further progress on your server to have it wiped. Please look at the details logically and do not let it skew your view.

 

Isn't it a little too soon to write such bold statements?

The amount of players online has decreased a lot since pre-wipe, just because people said that nobody would play doesn't mean that 35 is somewhere close to the 80+ online each day that used to be normal.
Also about the GTOP100 ranking, read above post.

I don't know if you are not familiar with the system your server is actually using, or if you are just throwing lies out to convince us that you guys did the right choice and hope for the best.

 

I stated facts, my opinion came at the end. Stating ratios and showing that the competitive gap will only worsen with this change is not an opinion. Look at what I bolded; this is your argument, the rest is a very unsuccessful attempt to outwit me in a simple minded senseless way. Read your argument, read my argument; tell me again about who is stating an opinion, and who is making an argument based on derived facts.

The server isn't losing people because it's too easy; the server is losing people because it lacks the long term diversity of features which is an intrinsic problem of a v62 GMS style private server. It is also losing people with it's regressive irrational decisions.

Don't bite on meat you can't chew.

@john
"Quality over Quantity"; you had quality when you started the server, you lost most of your quality and you are now going to find that you won't have the quantity either. Unless what you're saying now is that your original community did not comprise of quality and only with this reducing change have you finally gotten it, ridiculous, this is a false statement and I suggest you not to stand by it for the sake of credibility.

@ Vergil

I concur with the items/scrolls and have already made a point on it. 4x is centered around hardcore players as it provides the best opportunity for fruition in the server if you grind hard, 20x damages the competitive aspect; the reason most servers tend to vary around 8x-14x these days is because it creates a balance between allowing casual gamers to enjoy more features of the game, while allowing hardcore games to still need to work hard to get to 200 and essentially experience higher end features. Either way, these features aren't even appealing in v62 so it's going to be a huge slap in the face when people realise that the game has not changed at all, and that they'll only have less motivation to grind because there's nothing new to grind for.

The upper loyal base will definitely be a shell of what is was, but I'm sure that quite a few will stay for mostly the community aspect and some hardcore players will fight for a while. The casual gamers will be much less inclined to play.


I'm glad people are supporting this server, I wish it the best myself, but be realistic and stop trying to give me pathetic straw man arguments. The only response I should really respond to is Vergil because he had the decency to provide a real perspective.

 

It didn't show as premium on GTOP that you did. There was no gold border around your server ad.

If you are not familiar with GTOP, if you purchase premium during 1 month, the 100 votes and premium banner activates the next.

I will quote it from GTOP as well as bold it for you.

Citations - http://www.gtop100.com/premium/

 

It's easier to just not respond, it would save some face. I just hate those cheesy false one liners.

I'm not sure what you're saying; my argument was saying that if a certain class needed a certain amount of time to level, a less advantaged class would need a lot more time to level in contrast to when it was a higher rate (refer to OT). That is the only difference, changing the rates does nothing itself as the ratio is the same; however in terms of time, the ratio itself is multiplied.

You need 1 minute before now you need 2.5.
A weaker class needed 2 minutes before, it now needs 5.

So mathematically speaking, the competitive nature of the server will only worsen. It is more competitive at first from the aspect that everyone starts at level 1 and the leveling curve is note drastic at first; that is not much different from 10x, and furthermore it's the longer term aspects which matter and this fails to address the issue of competition.

We'll just have 1 person who's 170, 2 160s, 7 150s, and then the median above 90 will be around 120-130 rather than 150 as it is now. I'd rather a median of 150 any day, why? Because people are more inclined to quit when struggling to level at 120 than 150 for obvious reasons (less to do).

 

Even if you did have premium last month, how does it make my statement void as a whole. If you wish to omit statements, feel free, but this is not the once free community that I have joined before. I have seen multiple players who quit from this wipe banned on their forum accounts. For as little reasons as disagreeing with your decisions on the server. Which in my opinion is very unprofessional and petty. It also eliminates the chances of their return or at least their recommendation to peers on a private server.

 

I think I'm trying to say something similar. It will be competitive at first, but mages will have the obvious advantage in the late game. As happened in GMS, it's not this server so much as a fundamental issue with early versions of MS as a whole. Economically it'll be more equal because everyone starts out in the same place, no more G coins, and no more farming gach tickets. (Easier at higher levels.)

But eventually the level difference with become more stark between hard-core and casual/new players. That's the part I don't think will be competitive, but that won't happen for a while.