In Discussion Content Rose Garden Nerf/Adjustments

you meantioned F/P so mages can do RG still? if so how long does it take you. Do you think i can do it on an ice lighting?

 

Sure provided you max chain lightning and buy a wand 8, 20 bees might be rough if your magic is low (though not as hellish as with bishop).

Try to go in with echo (but beware free fm echoes will make a ton of people rush to RG all at once)

Please do not just spam ulti against the boss, worst thing you can do.

F/P is a bit faster in boss but I/L has less annoying bonus.

 

Best I got so far was 20 bees with ~6mins left on my naked F/P. Doing first map helps a lot because it’s fire weak.

As the person above me said, just remember bringing a ewand 8 and have Chain Lightning maxed since CL > Blizzard on 1v1 DPS by a lot, especially if you use the proper weapon. Also to optimize DPS, have Ifrit maxed too and always stay in range so you hit with both CL and Ifrit.

 

I literally posted a video of ice lightning mage in RG in your feedback thread f3

 

I last posted in this thread about a month ago when I first started running RG on my NL, and have been running almost daily since then. Wanted to give my updated thoughts now that I'm much more experienced with RG + have run with much better gear.

My thoughts on the content itself hasn't changed too much. I enjoy that it's something I can just hop on and do to make money without having to be a mage or message people/smega to get a party going, and while I do generally look around for SE+Echo before I go in nowadays to maximize my chances to cap bees, that's a personal choice to maximize my odds rather than a necessity, so I don't mind at all. Logging my times and bee count over the course of the last month has made it clear that no other content besides APQ even really comes close to the meso/hour I get at RG as a solo NL, so I definitely appreciate it existing, even if it's not the "buffed" version that people got to experience that I never tried. While sometimes it's a bit discouraging to run daily (for reasons I'll talk about below) I definitely still enjoy it as a whole, since it's much more engaging than most bosses.

When I initially started running RG at 170, my range with MW20 was around 5.5k-6k and I was doing room 3 for energies. Since then I've upgraded almost every piece of my gear, switched to room 1 for easier bees, and leveled 10-15 times over the course of the last month or so to improve my range to 7-7.2k with MW20. I used to not look around too much for SE/Echo, but now I rarely go in without them. I alternate between triple appling + double stopper and Pineapple chew stages 1/2 into 2 apples (I will override my chew with apple the second I start hitting boss on stage3) and then stoppering the rest. Before I upgraded my 82 RC to my 91 RC, (put my range around 6.5k) I basically never got 20 bees outside of getting exceedingly lucky, even when triple appling. Once I upgraded, I would get 20 bees around 1/3 of the time when triple appling. When I upgraded my CGS from 29-35 as well as some of my other gear (putting me around 6.8-7.2k range) I started getting 20 bees in most of my runs (I'd estimate 80%) but this is also with the caveat that I was running on Christmas event and I also had the 1.2x coupon from the event.

While I understand that ranged attackers are worse (and should be worse) than melee classes when it comes to content that focuses more on mobbing than bossing like RG, I feel like it's a bit extreme. The fact that I have a 91 RC, decent untradeables, solid CGS, prebuffs/MW20/triple apple, and I STILL will not cap bees even when sometimes spending ~30 minutes in bonus with decent map rotations + taunt20 optimizations while also on a bonus drop coupon + a bonus drop event is crazy to me. While I fully understand that the chance at earrings/ring as well as guaranteed totems + nx makes RG well worth it to do vs other content even when you aren't capping, it just feels BAD to spend so much time and not cap. I can understand that increasing the rate of bees can lead to the content becoming too efficient for meso generation for the classes/players that run multiple RG a day, so I'd propose that rather than increasing drop rate, it would be better to add another 5-10 minutes on the timer to accommodate the weaker characters who struggle to cap in the time limit. I don't play other classes, but from what I can gather, people generally aren't sticking around after they cap to kill the mobs for XP, so adding time shouldn't really buff the meso/hour for the people who are cycling through RG as fast as possible unless the bee limit gets removed again, while it would be greatly appreciated for the weaker characters running RG. I suppose there's some argument of the risk of adding more meso inflation into the economy as some weaker RG characters will start to generate more meso, but I feel like on the whole it shouldn't have too much impact.

 

Can you guys slow down the golems? Why are they the fastest… they’re made of rocks ffs…

 

Hi, so this feedback is based on someone who:

• Never did RG v.1
• Only done RG for a month; more or less so far.

(Do note this commentary might be all over the place.)
Honestly, I really like rg. The content itself is the reason why I got more motivated playing Royals. I think every method to earn mesos has been quite too much for my taste. If you want chill then it will be very slow to earn mesos and inconsistent. RG made me want to stay playing and gave me hope for earning mesos without losing my sanity. I play 3 chars with RG so far and these are my takes:

Spoiler: Bishop

If I sell skele leech, my bishop’s level is too high now (193) and people now wants 15x bs doing tc. Back in 2018 even Bishops with higher levels could still sell leech, but now skele leech is a bit demanding and no I don’t want to make another bishop for it. I actually like RG because it strives me to reach 200 with my bs. Back then because all I think that leech is the only way to earn mesos (the most my sanity could take) with my bs I never wanted to level her, If I did it would be a hell of a ride, especially to someone who isn’t that much into bossing, so while my bishop took 4-5 years to reach 200, I’m actually happy she will be leveling 200 with different sources now. For me it’s HT, LHC and Rose Garden. Thank you to the Staff for making this happen. I love that I have different ways to level now, I never liked the idea of leveling my bishop all the way to 200 with just Horntail/Auf runs and selling Skele leech.

I like RG with bishop because I don’t have to get into someone’s expectations, and I don’t tc to anyone who does goodjob But as of the moment even without tc I have 3-7 mins of spare time, which I still tend to stay until time runs out due to the exp I need.

Spoiler: Dark knight

I leveled her to 200, years ago and atm I’m leveling my sair and bs. So while I’m leveling them I actually am a bit upset about not running much with her on stuff until my characters reach 200, as I prefer prioritizing leveling them first. So I’m happy rg exists for this reason, I get to play her with good purpose and It’s still a choice whether I do so or not for the day. I can honestly skip her and just do bs and sair on rg, but she’s the most relaxing one to play on RG, personally more than my bishop, so despite I can skip her I don’t, and I’m happy my 200 attacker doesn’t feel useless to make mesos unless I do bossing.

Spoiler: Corsair

I think I’m really hard on this job. I’m least excited when I do sair on rg It’s my fav class but a pain in the ass in here, but it needs to be done. Before I would even skip her but now I do my best not to for exp-wise. It’s not the best in Rose Garden, but at least not the worst. If anyone wondering I’m currently lvl 186, with mw20. I run 1-2 apples with her, tho I think stoppers is good enough. Nothing to say much really, but I guess you really need to be funded for the job. I’m gonna assume I’ll need at least 8.5k clean range to comfortably do rg on sair with mw20 + echo + gizer. If someone does 20 bees with echo, mw20 and gizer with a lower range, do let me know. :3

I love how rg gave me a choice on how to make mesos. I love my bishop, but I don’t want to see her farming or leeching her soul out. I like how I can be level 200 and she can still earn mesos through something a mage is good with that fits my book. Rose Garden maybe just another way of farming, but at least it’s still more interesting than staying on one channel and spam gen/blizzard/meteor for hours. You have to go through different stages, even fight a boss as a mage so that’s cool. Sooo atm, I still don’t consider Rose Garden as boring, if it were it’s at least not the most boring and braindead way to get mesos out there xD Also I love how I can use different characters each time. Each run feels unique so? I can even skip whoever I want, at least it gives variety too. As for the 100m for 40 minutes, I think it’s fair considering that for funded players they are bound to be needing less time. So that means you still need to climb on top to get there, which makes sense to me ?? At least for me, this gives everyone a chance, casual player or not. Also take note that you still need to be funded to do Rose Garden so despite you can go inside at 170+ you won't be getting 20 bees right away, which is balance to me.

I think idm if it makes the "rich richer" in this issue because this method at least fits everyone. It kinda fixed what I have had problems with Royals for years. For instance; I never liked bossing much. I like bossing for fun and to hang with friends, not to earn mesos in which case my circle of friends feels the same way. So while some do bossing daily for mesos I do boss only to hang out with friends and exp, the mesos were always a bonus. This also fixes the problem that you aren’t forced to pick HT all the time. Sorry if the recruit on HT has gotten bad but.. I like people has now have the freedom/leeway to choose how to earn their mesos? It also takes away the issue of waiting an hour or so just to get a full HT party which can be frustrating, even before RG existed this used to be an issue already anyway so personally for me this is a solution, at least my friend thinks it is. Personally, I’m a LHC enjoyer than HT enjoyer myself too. But now we have a choice to do something else besides waiting for hours for possibly nothing.

Sooo personally I have no complaints from RG now, the inconsistency of bee spawning for me isn’t as terrible as I heard from other people as I always get 20 bees, time might be tight at times but I still get 20, maybe those are from the old patch? I hope so. So about future adjustments I worry, I don’t want it to be another dead content. I’m fine it can have tradables, but don’t nerf it just because you want more bossers in the game and give people a choice of how they want to utilize their bees. Not everyone is happy about this one but I’ll just say I quite am and my friends too.

 

Here I can't give you NL buffs but I can give you a meme during these troubling times

 

not interested in reading the whole thread, so excuse moi if this has come up, and i have a feeling it must be intentional bc it's so weird, but why do fresh mobs get autotargeted before the golem boss i've been attacking for five minutes, even when i'm standing on top of the boss [because i'm trying to avoid accidentally hitting mobs]? couldn't be closer or more inside the boss hitbox with 1v1 attacks, but the new spawns always get autotargeted and then my 1v1 only hits the mobs until they're gone.

 

Does that only happen after the boss "teleports"? By fresh mobs, do you mean mobs that spawns into the map, after the boss had teleported?

 

well idk about other players lol, but i can't kill the boss before it teleports the first time, so yes, any new spawned mobs are preferred. if this is due to teleporting, which is one of the things i figured, ok, that answers that, but it's still really annoying to blow an assassinate/bstep macro where only bstep lands on the boss i'm hugging. i don't really understand it though, because i cast ambush before he tele's to help me run to him faster if i have the client on widescreen, because ambush follows it through a teleport and i can use it to telegraph which way to go faster. so if ambush continues through his tele, then i should still have the boss autotargeted before a new mob, unless ambush also has weird independency

 

In the past, One of the staff explained the way teleporting is implemented into the game (they had to get creative for it to work) for ephenia. The old boss basically turns invisible and hides and can no longer be attacked, an a new boss spawns with the same stat/debuff as the old boss, but the map still considers it as a freshly spawned enemy. Melee attacks always targets oldest mob in the map first if multiple are within range. Something changed about teleporting when VL came out as mentioned in staff blog but nothing pertaining to age of mobs.

 

it only hurts so bad because it's too accurate

 

Just finished rg, and.. I think 20 bee cap should be 20 powder cap, even if a bee disappears. I find it very annoying that bees spawn at one corner of the map and you miss it, needing to go back and forth just for it to expire. So either let us get infintte bees until we reach 20 as long as there's time left, or give us some sort of guidance on where the bee is on the map, maybe a minimap mark (although i don't know if that's possible)

 

After pages and pages warning about the inflation from the massive meso injection I think it's wild that this was not addressed yet. Please change it from raw meso to anything else. Probably totems, at whatever the equivalent rate for 100m is (i.e., remove the ability to sell bees, add totems to the exchange).

The inflation is ramping up.

 

If the reward is raw mesos, people will continue doing RG until the inflation causes the reward to be no longer worth your time. If people are willing to do it for 100m/40 mins, they will all do so, until 100m becomes worth less due to inflation. Whatever the reward, if it's raw mesos, it will always cause inflation until we hit a point where the meso reward is no longer worth the time investment.
No product is being produced, no goods are being generated, its nothing but a pure injection of additional currency into the economy. With more money yet equal goods, goods prices will increase as demand increases.
This is terrible for anyone who does not have a level 170+ character, as they will still feel the effects of inflation without being able to partake in the income source that causes the inflation. If RG is not changed to produce some sort of actual useful good instead of raw currency, it will essentially cause economic stagflation which will be terrible for everyone. The effect isn't particularly pronounced, so its not going to ruin everything overnight, but just look at the trend in WS/CS/Taru prices over the last year to see where things are headed.
Balancers can presumably see the exact payout chances of LHC gach to determine the average value of a totem, and then make bees exchangeable for totems instead of sellable for mesos. The value of goods from the LHC gach would fluctuate over time, but thats a GOOD thing. It could of course also be something other than Totems, even a direct exchange of bees for CS/WS or something, but everyone loves to play gach, right? On top of that it wouldn't be too hard to add or remove items from LHC gach, or tweak reward rates, in order to rebalance things without having to alter the mechanics of RG itself.
This way something of use (other than one kind of earring only useful to thieves) would actually be produced by RG, people doing RG would still gain money, and new and less-funded players will gain the benefits of an economy with more ample resources.

 

I'd love this. There can never be too many ws/cs on the market and it's what most people save for anyway, without all the raw meso causing inflation.

 

Well that's the point of totems. To be an exchange for commonly traded lategame items. That's why it'd work well.

 

The meme is real and harsh, you can understand how unfair the balance is here, being SE permanent I don't suffer much because the areas are elemental, while the Nl have no elemental damage and only damage to one target, plus the avenger Hay Remains a little more damage to be specified.