Hi, Just wanted to share some things I'm concerned about before Pink Bean's release. There are a bunch of things that I believe should happen before the boss is released to ensure this doesn't just become more of the same (such as class balance), but this thread is not about that. There are really pressing issues that will likely completely break the boss, and can slip by staff as they're hard to notice while testing. It would be bad if those issues slip by on release, and as a result the boss will just break on the first attempts. Those issues should be easy to solve as they don't require major dev work (I think). The goal of making this thread is to get staff's attention and make sure they are aware of the following issues. Aggro change: I already talked a bunch about why I think patch 95.1 (and everything after it as a proxy, by not fixing it) was terrible for the game, but again, this is not what this thread is about. This change introduced some side effects that can totally ruin a new boss release, and will not be visible when testing. 1) When attacking with 30 attackers (even less, anything over 20 really), bosses just go afk and behave in a way that just eliminates all boss mechanics. This can mean that you can release a boss, test it with the existing staff members but completely not take into account what happens when big parties will run it at the start, which is guaranteed. An example of this happening can be seen here: (or on any speedrun/theme run done lately) 2) If there are 1 shot mechanics that you need to time (which PB is famous for), they might just not happen on time. It's well known by now that things just happen much later sometimes since 95.1 (VL mobs/jail, HT seds etc.). This problem does not exist in small parties, especially ones with a low amount of Buccs, so again it will not be so obvious while testing. Barrage: During the attempt to fix animation cancels in VL, some change was done to Barrage (intentionally or not). Old barrage used to only push boss mobs a certain distance, and after that they were free to move. Now, Barrage knocks back bosses (or boss mobs) a much bigger distance, and stun locks them for a long time. This can easily be replicated on a Gargoyle in VL, or on Auf. I doubt that anyone who runs Auf since that patch hasn't noticed how far their Barrage pushes her now. This again created 2 issues: 1) Bosses get pushed very far as mentioned before, which is not a good thing with PB being a boss that can be knocked back, similar to Auf. 2) Barrage causes bosses to delay their skills. This can easily be obsereved by watching the same size VL party with 1 Bucc, compared to 2-3 Buccs or more. Buccs using Barrage will cause mob/jail timers to be delayed for whatever reason, but they will get a fake animation of them exactly when those skills are off cooldown. You can only imagine how bad this can be when you have skills that you need the time in PB, especially if your caller is a Bucc. Assassinate ignores DR: This is more of a suggestion, but I think that if class balance does not arrive before PB, this is the one change that needs to be done. It wont be fair for Shadowers to ignore what might be a deadly 1 shot mechanic, while also having smokes. It will just be the same meta as VL, but perhaps even worse. Some of these things could already be on staff's radar, but I wanted to make this thread anyway, just to make sure it's all known and being worked on. I hope we get PB soon as promised
I remember that run; even I was surprised by the incredible delay VL had when executing his attacks, and sometimes he'd just stand still. We even laughed; it was funny. But at least we know it's preferable for the staff to have a team of at least 30 people to help with testing and thus see the impact of how each class and each ability is executed. From what I remember in Broa and Khaini, where I come from, back in late 2007/2008, we were able to defeat PB a couple of times with 25/30 people, with the exclusivity that we got the Apples at exorbitant prices, and PB defeated us more than 40 times, maybe more, maybe less, but that's my suggestion. Maybe they won't like it, because the game itself is full of sinners, haha, just kidding, watch out for that :V byeeeeeee
Pink beans “only 1 shot mechanic” is DR. I know VL also is supposed to have DR (removed here I think I haven’t VLed here) and then his infamous lasers but pink bean was supposed to be the boss before VL. We should be more than capable of beating bean (with ease) seeing how VL is being defeated. and shads Nate really ignores DR??? Imagine being the top dpser in ST that doesn’t need SE/SI AND has better survivabiliy than warriors AND it ignores DR? No wonder everyone rolled to Shad’s when I came back to this game, that class was non existent back in the day. That’s just straight up jokes smh.
You do realize that PB is almost certainly going to be a custom fight and be balanced to be harder than VL, right? Just like how our VL is customized from the GMS version. And yeah #NerfShad
It'll be to an extent, VL is more fluid to customize while PB is more linear having to deal with the statues whether it's in phases or all at once. And I'm against nerfing classes, I'd rather buff the others instead of nerf them as a whole.
Hope PB is customized too. =>stay at center only (I heard this idea from other post) =>Bossing event (like 15golem / gargo / jail) ●jail ? ●summon 1~5 of 5 statues ●30 mini bean event
Idk if they can actually BUFF other classes to be on par with shad, coz they removed the "charge" on nate and dishing 950% dmg and now ignores DR. How to buff others tho?
It doesn’t have to be completely on par, but the gap has to be a lot closer than it is, it’s much too far.
wouldnt work tbh, it'd hinder their dps pretty badly especially at this point, and if they do they'd need to allow you to pot/use will while in dark sight
They werent suppose to have it in the first place #Shrug, might well make corsair ship unbreakable too.
corsair in all my years I've played maple is probably THE WORST class I've ever played, I pray for sair players having the patience to play such a handicapped class with temporary power. I don't even think a perma ship would make me want to play that class still LOL. But tbh not a bad idea haha. But no, dark sight was tweaked in later versions of MS due to the flawed nature of it. It even allowed you to pot during the classic MS beta. That alone spoke volumes of the QOL direction.
nooo don't fix Dr ignore for ass, I was hoping to macro pure ass in PB and laugh at every other jobs in their face jk well kudos to a pro shad player for flagging out this, this is what I would really call a well-honored community player
The other thing that would make me really sad is if on day one we see a party of all shads clear it by sitting in smoke the entire run while meso bombing. Not to take away from the groups that pioneered that with VL to clear with smaller numbers, it was very clever at the time. But if we see that happen again with PB that would be very disappointing and anticlimatic. My hope is to see PB force the community to come up with new tricks and find ways for other classes to shine.
I hope they've done something about those issues you mentioned; we'll see. I've said it before, and I'll say it again. The shad buff was way too op, even though it was fun, along with allowing mules in bosses' kill balance. Shads became so op throughout the years, and expensive to gear due to demand. Now people just make shad, bucc, crash, lightly gear each, then multi client solo/duo everything. This is slowly just turning into a solo rpg but with more steps.
One way to fix the bossing issue with everyone bringing mules is just limit the amount of clients a single person can enter boss rooms with like they do with Cake and Snowman. Preferably that limit is made to be 1. Doesn't stop you from leeching your own character, doesn't stop you from trading with yourself, doesn't stop you from HSing yourself at BF or Anego or any other open world boss. Just affects "instanced" bosses. People are gonna optimize the fun and social aspect out of anything in the name of "convenience". Yeah its convenient to just mule 6 clients to avoid awkward social interactions or relying on someone who may fuck up your run. God forbid you have failure in an MMO but whatever. Its more important to eliminate all possible outside chances you may fail or lose meso or else its not worth playing the game. Obviously im exaggerating this a little bit, but this thought process is not healthy for the social aspect of the game that was built on the foundation of socializing and needing the assistance of your fellow players to accomplish stuff in game. Like its been said before there needs to be foundational changes made to the game or else Pink Bean is just gonna be another 3 class boss. If nothings changed I cant wait to see how Pink Bean is fought with Shadowers, Bucc's and NL's and everything else is just brought in as mules. You know the real "nostalgia"
Actually, I think we don't need to worry too much about PB having this kind of issue. If PB is a boss that is even more difficult than VL, many mechanics alr force ppl to focus on, such as: Jail One-hit kill Laser / TL / Reverse / Gargoyle / Golem ... But this is still a big problem for other daily bosses. (Especially on NT bosses) Another issue is class balance in PB. If this isn’t addressed, it’s easy to imagine the best PB party is [6 Shad/5 Bucc/1 BS]. Since I’d like every class to have a unique and meaningful role in PB, we could consider strengthening team-oriented mechanics for classes outside of Shad/Bucc/BS: NL: Objects that must be destroy quickly with basic attacks, similar to BPQ. Sair: I don't know everything about sair. BM: Introduce extremely high-speed, dangerous mobs MM: Freeze effects, 15+ mobs events I/L: dangerous mobs that require Silence / Slow, Freeze effects F/P: dangerous mobs that require Silence / Slow, Poison effects(e.g., mobs with 200M HP that are affected by poison) Pally: Tank (–20% damage skills), Freeze effects, permanent physical cancel Hero: Tank (–20% damage skills), DEF & ATK buff cancel, and stun effects DK: DEF & ATK buff cancel
I really appreciate you admitting that you don’t fully understand the class, unlike those who tried to pretend they did and ended up making suggestions that put this class in a bad spot. Here are the Sair mechanics I think are worth exploring: Homing Beacon (egg): Egg allows Sairs to mark a specific mob and hit the marked target through blocking mobs or objects (such as the CWK mage pillar). Perhaps introduce a dangerous mob that players would want to kill quickly, but it is far away and often blocked by groups of mobs or objects. Hypnotize: Hypnotize allows Sairs to make a non-boss-tagged mob attack other mobs. Perhaps introduce an unkillable mob that deals critical AOE damage and roams around the map until it despawns after a few minutes. Players could either silence, stun, freeze, or doom it, or use Hypnotize to turn it against PB or other mobs to greatly help the player side. Other minor utility skills: Throwers can do DOT dmg, Splitters can freeze, Blank Shot can stun. I really like the idea of giving every class a specific job to do in PB. I hope this information and these ideas help.
