In no particular order: I don't think it's necessary for answers to be submitted through whisper to the GM. If we apply the normal rules (only the team leader can give an answer, only one answer is accepted, no answers = wrong answers, and answers must be submitted within the time limit), I don't see any reason why our answers must be whispered. This way everyone can clearly see whose answer was sent first, and/or who was the first to give the fully correct answer. It'd be easy to enforce this rule as well, i.e. if non-leaders try making comments in All chat when it's party-leaders-only, it results in disqualification for the whole team. I have no way of knowing who sent in what answers in what order, so I'll keep my reservations to myself this time around, but I don't think the whispering is necessary at all. From the event description in the forum, I was under the impression that each category would be of equal importance: What is "Around the World"? - Betrayal Q&A (MapleROYALS trivia) - Name that Item (Simply put: name the item dropped by a GM -- includes spelling, capitalization and punctuation) - Wheel of Fortune (fill in the missing letters) - "No one ever listens to me" (things NPCs say that players tend to overlook) - T/F (simply put: true & false statements related to MapleRoyals) - If another staff member is available -- a JQ Round - A new addition! Mob Madness (name the mob after being given clues) http://royals.ms/forum/threads/team-based-around-the-world-schedule-rules-sign-ups.21990/However, the way the events played out seemed a bit unbalanced. There was ONE Betrayal Q&A question, the subject of whom was actively participating in the event as a competitor. There were NO T/F questions whatsoever. Most importantly, the order in which the events were started, as well as how much longer some were than others, was extremely unevenly weighted (Why was NPC chat ended after only three questions? Why was there no second JQ until after around 13-15 additional trivia questions? Why were none of the following JQs paired up with WoF rounds?) -removed for inaccuracy To nitpick over little minor details that we were specifically told did not matter and punish us for those mistakes is dishonest and unfair. Case in point: "Mapler's Rock" vs. "Maplers Rock" during one of the Trivia segments. The Omok question: if no one answered in the format you were looking for, when you did not provide a clear format for answers to begin with, then skip the question and move on. If you were trying to compensate with the answers you were given, then at the very least our team's answer ("Pink Teddy Panda, Slime Orange Mushroom, Bloctopus") should have been enough to show that we knew the material you were looking for. This was actually the question on which the first place team was given the win, while with our answer we were asked to move down a platform instead of up (up would have meant we won, as we were right below the winning platform - dunno if two winning teams would've posed a problem?). For all teams in general, at the very least penalization for this question should have been skipped. If the question is faulty the blame shouldn't lie on the players. (Along this line of thought - there was one question about the snail-shaped bush in Amoria for which no advance notice was given whatsoever, and the GM notices went directly from giving the previous question's answer to asking the next question.) Thanks for reading. **EDIT: I felt like I should make clear, none of this is meant to be a personal attack or sassbomb on anyone whatsoever.
Betrayal Q&A is trivia. Also Chance's team didn't win with the JQ/WoF, they won both those rounds when they were at the bottom platform.
One comment on your feedback: Chance's team (which included me) did not get a jump quest to take the third place. Other than that:: I agree that it'd be 'better' to reply to the questions in all-chat. Disqualification for the whole team (if you mean from the event as a whole) is a bit harsh, but they could be punished by, for example, not being allowed to answer the following 2 questions. Seeing as there aren't that many teams there, it should be easily manageable.
My bad, for some reason I assumed "MapleROYALS" to mean specific to the Royals community, and separate from general Maple trivia.
I've answered this in a previous feedback suggestion (in the ATW thread) before. If a person is required to answer in all chat, you can easily obtain the answer from another team, if a lot of people are saying: "Snail" I'm sure that influences the type of answer your team puts out. You are required to answer for each question or it's considered a wrong answer (you move down a platform for a wrong answer). This is why all chat doesn't work out. If someone was supposed to be specific i.e "Maplers Rock" and a team answers "Mapler's Rock" another team can jump on the chance to correct them. There were quite a few trivia questions. Betrayal Q&A is pretty much maple trivia but it involves kicking players from the event because our player base is so large, it's hard to do that kind of event with 100+ players needing to get points. I refer to it as Betrayal Q&A because (when we would host events daily, every 8 hours) that's what people knew Maple Trivia to be. There are some months where I do a specific event and other months where I don't do the event, this was one of them (in regards to T/F). I pick and choose when to go on to another question/event, because I am the hostee. GMs host an event at their own discretion. I avoid JQs if a team is at the platform before winning and give (what I considered) a harder question out of the bunch that I have. I usually do WoF rounds AS a JQ is going on, yes. I had some stuff going on outside of the event that I chose to take breaks to handle while players were in the JQ. They won the JQ round and were brought to the platform before the winning platform. I did a "Name that NPC" round and they won the first question, thus they took third. "To nitpick over little minor details that we were specifically told did not matter and punish us for those mistakes is dishonest and unfair. Case in point: "Mapler's Rock" vs. "Maplers Rock" during one of the Trivia segments" I spoke to Courtney in whisper and told her what I had said in the earlier event, if someone is going to spell it correctly, I'm more than likely to go with their answer. You were all made well aware of this considering I mentioned it before the event started. I decided that it would be completely okay for her to stay on her current platform rather than having her team move down one. Here was the question: Name four different monsters (full names, no abbreviations other than ‘&’) that come together to make two separate omok sets. You may not use the same mob twice. Pink Teddy Panda is not a monster, the team had fused it into one answer which I didn't accept because no one else had typed out their answers this way. I also didn't blame anything on the players, I said it would take me some time to check the answers and to bear with me. I was apologizing for how long it was taking. For the criticism you are giving, I don't see any ways that I can make things better. Just nit-picking at what went wrong in an almost two-three hour event (on average) that I run monthly. EDIT: There are bound to be some bumps in the road for such a long event.
Like I said, the same rules that are applied to whisper can be applied to answer submission through All chat. Limiting team leaders to one answer and one answer only within the time limit wouldn't have to be changed. To ensure that it's only team leaders who are speaking in all chat, if anyone else speaks it could result in disqualification or, as workteam stated, barring the offender's team from answering for successive rounds. This wouldn't allow players to correct each other at all. Additionally, whether or not your team leader copies someone else's answer is entirely up to them - there's no point in typing out an answer that A) has already been said by someone else, especially if B) that answer could be wrong. I still think people would try to check their answers with their teams before submitting them, unless they don't care about dropping platforms from wrong answers. I remembered incorrectly, and have already taken this part out of my original post. Re: Mapler's Rock vs. Maplers Rock This was an unfortunate typing error during answer submission. I'd argue that this is more of a punctuation issue than a spelling error, as we had all the letters in place and properly capitalized, but since technically the apostrophe changes the meaning of the phrase, I'll drop this argument. However, I think our answer was close enough that staying on our platform wouldn't have been unreasonable. Again, under the wording of the question, we did submit four different monster names. Joey chose to use commas in his answer to separate them into their respective sets (Pink Teddy Panda, Slime Orange Mushroom). As requested in the question, four different monsters were named and separated into two omok sets, and we didn't use any abbreviations or repeat mobs. If all that our answer would've required to be considered "correct" is additional punctuation (Pink Teddy, Panda; Slime, Orange Mushroom) then A) it's already clear that we knew the answer to the question - commas and semicolons don't change the meaning of the words written - and B) punctuation or a "proper format for listing answers" was not given in the first place. Also: Like I said, this post wasn't meant to be an attack on anyone; I wasn't questioning your event-running capabilities. I'm providing feedback from my first ATW on factors that I felt made it more of a negative experience than positive; whether you interpret it as feedback or targeted "nitpicking" is up to you, but it wasn't meant to be anything other than constructive.
A wrong answer means you move down a platform. If the question was "what's the highest level boss in royals" team1 (who answers first) "the boss" team2 could then see what team1 answered, and also reply with the same answer, so they don't go down a platform. or another example if the question was NPC chat "(the question was similar to this) what mob shoots cannons" some could say spirit viking, (but as we know from the event, the answer was gigantic spirit viking), but a team could read that answer and jump on that chance to answer with gigantic spirit viking.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but you also mentioned that the only event category that would strictly require absolute precision in the answer was Name that Item. For every other type aside from that event category, we were to try and get the right answer approximately/to the best of our ability. Though I don't have access to the order in which you received the whispers for the 'Maplers Rock' question, I'd like you to tell us who you would give credit to in the following scenario: Team 1 whispers "Mapler's Rock" first; Team 2 whispers "Maplers Rock" second. If you say Team 2 deserves the credit for being a more "correct answer," I would like to argue that the first team's response demonstrates clear understanding of what the answer is supposed to be (which is what we were told to go by in the Trivia rounds). If you want to argue that Team 2 is the undeniable victor, then you should revise your initial instructions and require full accuracy, including punctuation and capitalisation, for every category. On this statement, I believe that they won via the 3rd NPC round, not the first - Shiroshi's team won the first two rounds of Name that NPC. Why does this matter? Without proof of the chat log, I can't verify anything - however, I feel like the event category was changed comparatively quickly away from Name that NPC. Why did this happen? I wouldn't be able to tell you, but there was a definite imbalance in the event category types used. Specifically, the number of Trivia questions asked (both with respect to quantity and consecutive execution) far outweighed the other categories, including T/F and Name that NPC. Being given an event description in the manner that it was done left several people (myself included) under the impression that the weights of each category would be more or less equal. However, the choice of event type seems completely up to GM discretion - what sort of problems that may engender is something I will refrain from hypothesizing, simply due to lack of evidence on my part. To me, using a randomizer to decide the event category (as well as a fixed number of consecutive repeats allowed of the event category) would make the process more fair to all participants. Having such a cap on the number of consecutive rounds allowed per category would eliminate situations like the one from tonight's event, with an absurd number of consecutive trivia rounds (in which certain groups seem to have a very easy time winning; thus, fairness would entail equal opportunity for "JQ gods" and "Trivia gods" alike).
Please look at this screenshot and tell me he chose to separate his answer into their respective sets. He placed commas in-between the other three monsters, which lead me to believe otherwise. I discussed it with TimK, as I do with any issue that arises for a question, for a second opinion. I went with Linyah's answer because he separated all the mobs. The set is Pink Teddy AND Panda, Pink Teddy Panda is not a single mob.
I agree that such a problem for missed penalties is something that prevents All-chat from being used. However, I think we should be given the exact responses/order of responses to each question so that we can see what degree of leniency is being given to us. For the uninformed event participant, each nuanced rule in what constitutes a "correct answer" seems pretty important, as fractions of a second saved can result in a different order of responses.
The first example I gave crashes the ideal that there is no point in typing out an answer that has already been said by someone else. A wrong answer means you move down a platform. If the question was "what's the highest level boss in royals" team1 (who answers first) "the boss" team2 could then see what team1 answered, and also reply with the same answer, so they don't go down a platform. i'm still not sure what the drawbacks from whispers are? so you can't see other peoples answers, and how fast you are compared to others? I don't see why that should matter, since the Host sees them.
Just out of personal curiosity, what made you think I was typing out Pink Teddy Panda as a single mob? Forgetting to have one comma between Pink Teddy and Panda constitutes a wrong answer? One reason I bring this up is because this round was one that would've changed the outcome of the event prize winners. Another is because, again, we were told to convey the approximate answer to the question.
Well she asked for 4, even if you did add a comma it would have been 5, which isn't what she asked for.
I'm pretty sure she assumed that you meant Pink Teddy Panda as a single mob because otherwise you would've sent her 5 mobs (You've put commas to all others), which is not what she asked for.
Well, it seems that people are just going to bandwagon against what we're trying to point out - the main point I'm making isn't that one specific Omok question but the various things I and Kaeta have listed above. If the GM won't take a closer look at and spend more than 15 minutes thinking about possible changes to the event, that's unfortunate. No personally-aimed animosity intended
We replied to every question you asked, if you can't take 15 minutes to read what we wrote, then fair enough.
Too many quotes getting thrown around, so I'll just go back to the original points. RE: Omok Personal complaint: commas and semicolons don't change the meaning of the words submitted. We clearly knew the material she was looking for. We literally lost out on first place over a formatting error. General complaint: Looking at everyone else's answers, penalization for any of the teams wouldn't have been necessary (at the very least Hefty and Jaysunn's teams should've stayed, although after discussing with my team we're not sure if everyone apart from Linyah's team was moved down, or if Hefty's team did indeed get to stay.) Again, speaking for everyone at large and not just my own team, A) with the answers submitted it's clear that people knew the answer(s) to the question - commas and semicolons don't change the meaning of the words written - and B) punctuation for a "proper format for listing answers" was not given in the first place. How this point possibly applies to future ATWs: if the answers given are spelled correctly, relax on formatting or make it more clear what format you're looking for (i.e. give an example when stating the question; most obvious ex., for the Omok question: "Mob A & Mob B, Mob C & Mob D") RE: All Chat vs. Whisper Personal complaint: none General complaint: transparency How this point possibly applies to future ATWs: If your team jumps the gun and gives a wrong answer, it's no one's fault but your own. Answers would be submitted keeping in mind that other people can see your answers; if anything, I think using All Chat would make people more cautious, both about content and formatting, since the fact that other people can see what you're saying really makes it a one-shot at submission. Whether or not a team is right is up to your team to decide. Parroting an answer could still drop you down a platform if it's a wrong answer; it would still be worth looking up answers for yourself than blindly taking answers submitted by other players during the event. TLR transparency in this kind of event does more good than harm. RE: Events Personal complaint: none now (I misunderstood/misread the Betrayals = MapleROYALS Trivia description) General complaint: Unbalance in terms of which events were given the most weight. If there are people questioning the balance of events, you responding with "This is how I do things, don't question my authority" doesn't really work for me as an answer. An explanation of why certain events get more weight than others would suffice. Either that, or change the ATW signup thread to indicate that some events are worth more than others (i.e. 3 NPC Chat questions vs. approx 30 MapleROYALS trivia questions, no T/F questions). It's true that you host these events on your own time, but does that mean you won't consider any feedback submitted by participants afterwards? To restate: none of this is meant to be personal attacks on anyone, it's not us vs. you, scrub team vs. GMs. We're stating our concerns without any intention to offend or provoke, and as such I'd like to ask that hostility be left out of the conversation. **EDIT: This isn't meant to be a personal attack on you, Christine. With that in mind, please read what's been written as general questions for GMs who may choose to host ATW in future, or general suggestions as to how the event itself can be changed, as opposed to how you specifically should run things.
