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I like how thought out this is, and that it balances what buccs are about without trying to replicate what was broken in old source. Simply spamming demo isn't really fun nor does it bring out the reality of playing a bucc (which is all about combos), so buffing barrage's damage a bit is a nice, fair way of doing it still.
Though I'd like to see how much the delay reduction benefits us as well too! Maybe the two combined would make them competitive DPSers, still below NLs and such of course but it'd be nicer to close that gap a little.

 

I like this! Barrage is one of my favourite skills in the game and I hope it becomes the bread and butter it's supposed to be... I might finally level a bucc after all my other works in progress.



Joking aside though this is good A+. yay buccs, hope it works out for you folks

 

Interesting, you calculated all those figures out . I like your proposal. I have never played a buccaneer in old source, but I could totally see the temptation of being able to spam demolitions. However, I am not in favour of restoring it. I do not want to see myself disappearing the entire run. Also, part of the beauty I see in demolition is being able to wait for that moment to go super saiyan. The barrage and dragon strike combo looks way better. I've heard a lot from my non-buccaneer friends on how much they like barrage. Buffing it would be the way to go, but not as much as to render demolition useless (unless they buff demolition too).

You also mentioned about the energy charge 'buff'. I think the charge rate is an issue that needs to be addressed. I know a Buccaneer friend from old source who doesn't boss, but likes to train on it. He told me about how much the charge rate affected his training. For me, it is also very annoying because the stance effect is almost never here when I need it.

About lowering the cooldown of the skills, I was rather in favour of it until I read your proposal. Seeing other classes attack so rapidly certainly makes me jealous, but I never thought it out on how it'd affect the 'combo' part of the class. Similar to Sila, I'd also like to see how the delay reduction would turn out.

 

Buff marksman first pls
MM has lower dps than buck as some bucc was laughing at MM: "lol who would play mm?"

 

Probably would've seen this sooner but haven't been on these last couple of days to put in my 2 cents. Not to be biased or anything but I HIGHLY DOUBT reducing the delay on the Barrage + DS combo is gonna change anything! The delay being reduced has already been mentioned on the skill tables for the upcoming new source and wasn't even noticeable. Anything more then the speed were going at too is post big bang or simply spammable and dragon strike wouldn't be needed. Your more then welcome to prove me wrong and put a smirk on my face though @Andreas  . Anyways with the new source come we seen a plentiful amount of classes get a damage boost on their skills heck even buccs got a boost on energy orb a move we get to use 1/3 of the time, has a charge time of like 60-70 hits now, and is slower then dragon strike. I feel like this proposal my boy @Buccaneer has mentioned would be a pretty decent buff because if you look at the stat sheet and see where barrage stands for DPS among other classes when equally geared is quite comical sitting at just a little above 80k. My intent here isn't to complain because im perfectly fine playing the bucc class but if a buff does ever occur make it something thatll knock my socks off and make me proud of @Karven.

Spoiler: DPS CHART

 

I do want to point out that there are no plans to buff any class further than the new source did, nothing has been discussed, and might never happen.
However I have taken a quick look at some basic changes to Bucc skills, these might not ever see daylight but I do believe balance changes has to be talked about openly, so this is just my opinion from some minor testing.

Far as I am aware the reduced skill delays for the new source are fully client sided and was implemented by Nexon in versions leading up to v83, and if you look at later versions they continued decreasing the delays, don't seem like they did a very good job with it.
The sort of delay reduction for the Barrage + DS combo I have tested leaves the numbers at roughly 10-15% faster for a combo, it won't make them competitive in damage, nor make Barrage spam viable, it does make the skills a bit more responsive, something I find to be positive.

There are a few things I can imagine that would make it more fun to play them, increase damage on Barrage, decrease delays on Barrage + DS, longer uptime on stance, and easier to gain it.
Is that much different from what you see as needed for them?

In the perfect scenario where I can use Barrage + DS without interruption until the mob dies I don't see such a big difference in damage, are you taking into account falling down and other factors related to not having invincibility frames all the time while using Barrage + DS?

Changing the damage of Barrage is very easy, and takes a few minutes, getting a damage buff approved and put on the server takes a bit longer

 

Just change stun mastery into critical punch or something. Stun mastery is useless and stun doesn't even work right now. It will make the class much stronger (especially with SE) but not overpowered or something cause the skills are still slow and with delays.

 

As someone who has played this class into oblivion, I agree with many of the points made. Bucc was never meant to be this fast paced attacking class, they were meant to be slow, powerful, and combo oriented. However i agree that it really feels as if bucc is severely lacking in the power aspect, leaving the class pretty lackluster. I believe the boost to damage % idea would be an excellent fix to this problem and would balance the class out alongside breeding more variety in the bossing scene, leaving buccs with a better resume then just SI mules.

 

I support this thread. Demolition was capable of outputting high and stable damage in a relatively small time frame and was spammable, which is what made Buccaneers somewhat viable in bossing. It's depressing to boss with a Hero or DrK that can use one Brandish or Fury, and output about as much damage as you did with one Barrage in a third of the time it took to cast Barrage (Not really referring to God-Tier geared Buccs). They can continue to spam their skill, meanwhile you have to chain your Barrage with Dragon Strike. Not to mention, their damage is far more stable than Barrage, which can deal anywhere from 50k on that last hit to 140k (I'm aware that the earlier hits may deal a bit more damage to compensate for this, but the insane range increase by apples or Gelts generally doesn't accommodate for this entirely).

This leaves Buccs with an unspammble, slow, unstable, and weak skill as our primary attack. This damage increase would account for the flaws in speed, as the 6 hits would deal much more damage than one use of the aforementioned warrior skills that don't have these speed flaws. The high damage for lack of speed per Barrage wouldn't allow us to significantly out DPS all warriors, but still give us a chance in competing with them, which creates a good balance.

 

Tbh I really agree with OP here. Regardless of whatever you think, it's severely underwhelming after seeing the changes made to Bucc. Was supposed to be a buff but instead it got fucked. If you disagree with me, ask yourself: Other than leeching yourself and washing when you're 135 or so so you can boss do you know what it's like to play the class to that degree?

I have been telling people for a long time all Bucc needed to balance out everything was a damage increase (aside from now the current issue with energy charge..) I hope this is something that is actually being worked on and is not completed yet but if I'm going by Andreas' earlier post, then that's really quite something..

 

Even though I agree zSmoke, I can safely say I know what it's like to play the class from 10-135 at least! My previous bucc, which is now a retired TL mule, was played normally all the way up until I realized I screwed up HP washing. Hence new bucc. lol

 

Bucc needs a buff ... i was 1 of the bucc's with privateer in the entire server.
while everyone just calls me si mule, I have some descent items. even a level 143 drk with no item can out damage me. i am lvl 170.
Unfortunately i have decided to offically quit bucc 1 week ago.
but please buff it. The new source patch has actually nerfed bucc. because the server have not fully used all the patch details on him. such as introducing new skills...
also the bug fix on bucc such as energy charge and time leap glitch has made a dramatic nerf.

 

I know @TakashiSan laid it out perfectly IMO. Screw Stun Mastery and change it with Critical Punch or w.e it is called. Would it really hurt if we needed SE? 90% of the parties if not 99% already have SE lol. Also not like it would LOWER DPS?? Better than stunning mobs (big whoop). I hear it's still not the best option and would take longer than a damage increase but this my 2 cents lol.

Buccs need a buff, simple as that. Another private server has all knuckles do like 15% more damage so you don't have to buff any skill in anyway it's already in the weapon and it works wonders in that server. There are actually a decent amount of Buccs there lol. All these changes people are suggesting wouldn't be game breaking and they would still be weak af. Were not asking to white a lvl 200 sair or nl but help us out! Reward the players that choose to go down the brawler road and make it more special. Nostalgia is suppose to be amazing and fun. Doesn't have to be 1:1. If it's not broken don't fix it but we could really use some love and fixing.

This prob will never see the day of light which is really sad and you guys gotta work on fixing the new sauce ok but in the meantime wouldn't a quick % damage increase or something for some skills/knuckles be fine? I feel like we all deserve something like this so small. Since we have all been so patient slowly waiting for the server to be 100%. This would be a great thanks for playing. NOT BASHING OR POINTING FINGERS I'M JUST SAIYAN! #buccslivesmatter #buccsnumbah1 #notsimules #nottlmules #makebuccsgreatagain #buff4buccs #plz

 

I Highly support any buccaneer buffs right now as I feel this class still stand out a little weaker than other classes.

 

I'd like to ask, would it be feasible to make the energy charge +20 weapon attack buff stackable with attack potions? I know it wasn't like that in gms, but since its a passive skill I believe it would feel right and give the class the "buff" it needs.

 

Ight, fine. No skill changes besides damage increase for our main combo. Woulda been nice to push the knuckle damage increase bc shit why not?! XD but I'll take anything. You're proposal is fair and seems easy/quick to implement there's really no reason not. Just time and A LOT of patience will tell, also keep this subject alive and keep pushing it will help.

 

I would love to see more class diversity, they don't need to be the strongest thing in the game just not miles behind everyone else would be nice.

 

I second the idea to make energy charge attack buff stack with pots, it'd be a simple way of getting a little extra damage with not just the barrage+ds combo, but with all of their attacks.

I'm a bit split on this idea. On one hand, having crits would be an easy way to boost dps for buccs, it would might make them too strong, as Privateer mentioned as well. Two ideas I had that might mitigate this issue is:

1) Replace stun mastery with critcal punch, but lower the amount of damage bonus you get from it (maybe something like +40%)

2) Keep stun mastery intact, but give passive crits during super transformation. It wouldn't stack with stun mastery, but it would allow the +60% damage chance that stun mastery gives to occur without the enemy being stunned.

I'm not sure exactly how easy it would be to implement some these changes on to bucc skills, but on paper, they sound like it would give them enough of a boost that they wouldn't be over powered, but would at least sorta be able to keep up with other warrior classes.

Lastly, something that isn't really related to bucc's barrage+ds combo or overall damage output, but what would be kinda nice is if bucc's corkscrew blow hit more mobs at once. Corkscrew blow is essentially Rush for buccs, but whereas rush can hit up to 10 enemies, csb can only hit 3 enemies. Perhaps hitting up to 6 mobs at once would be better, but again, this isn't super important, rather just a small little gripe I have with the skill. :3