Increase in demand for "low-level leech" since New Source

That would mess up with high level people that get exp from bossing.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but most of the time when people go bossing for exp, they'd have to reach a certain level. (e.g level 135 for zakum). Besides, when bossing for exp, they would be an attacker to say the least. So they would still get the EXP from the boss. Again, I haven't exactly reach that point in the game, so I don't know for sure..

 

Yes, but again, even if you have the level enough to get the exp from boss, if your "rule" for leeching was >20 Levels from the player as well, if you are in a party with higher level people, you'd not get the exp.

 

This argument is completely moot honestly. I'm astonished you would actually use this as an argument to keep leeching in the game. The way game design works is people will ALWAYS take the easiest path to win. It is 100% up to the game designers to make sure people don't leech if you don't want them to, because if you keep leeching in the game it is completely your fault that people are leeching.

The "it existed in GMS" point is also moot because leeching wasn't a problem there, and as soon as it did become a problem, Nexon DID in fact fix it. The fix is quite simple and I don't know why we haven't done it when several other private servers have. Simply change the Solo : Party exp from 60:40 to 80:20. Problem solved, leeching still exists but is very ineffective for lower levels, partying is still more effective than solo, etc etc.

 

How would you remove leeching without completely gimping party exp and ya know, party's who train together?

Second, what does it matter of person X leeches and person Y doesnt? Why does someone else leeching hurt you?

 

Yes, in the same way that someone hacking or cheating hurts me. It significantly lowers the value of my own accomplishments, and disincentivizes all other forms of playing the game.

 

The only way to "end" with leeching is giving mages ultimate skills cooldown.
But guess what, it's not gonna happen.

 

I actually like the change in party exp ratio. This way training in a oarty is still vible since the biggest benefit is the increase in monster spawn, but it becomes a lot harder to leech.

 

but... there's no set value to your accomplishments, it's subjective. Who cares. Someone else leeches, cool. You made it to 200 without leeching? Cool too, but like, 1-120 is a tiny fraction of what 120-200 is, which, even with leeching, all 200s do with grinding/bossing.

I guess I just don't see why it matters. You do you, and let other people do themselves, and just have fun.

 

I feel like it is just something that is so cemented in this version of maplestory and Royals in particular that it is too late to remove or change now without completely having to overall party exp and mage ultimates. Doing so would piss off a lot of players who spent a lot of time/mesos to pay for the extremely expensive mastery books as well. I don't particularly like leeching as a concept and wish there was a bigger incentive to party up and level while actively participating in the process but it simply won't be changed on this server. I am with Evan and what he said about just doing you, and enjoying your accomplishments while not worrying about what others did. You get out what you put in and just because somebody wants to spend all of their in game money to have someone do it for them doesn't mean that you can't enjoy the game separate from them while doing it your own way.

 

I could say the same about other "nostalgic" changes made to Royals you defend on other posts so.. are you really saying that?

I'm pretty sure GMS game designers didn't intend to make leeching this fast and I'm sure HP washing wasn't intended to be a thing either. So just because it was on GMS it doesn't automatically make it the right thing.

I'm not in favor of removing leeching because it would change the game too much, but something like at least buffing PQs is necessary.

 

Remember lionheart castle? For each member of the party the exp incresed. Make semi boss monsters and force party play! Be fun as he'll and good for the community

 

Id rather remove HP washing over remove leeching. But yes neither are that fun of a mechanic

 

QFT

round of applause

They buffed the PQs, thanks GMs/staff! You guys made the right decision!

A small victory, but this isn't over, but let us live to fight another day...

 

It's been 2 weeks since the PQ buffs but it seems to me that the issue at hand hasn't been solved.

 

But I can defeat that "force party play" system by bringing 5 mules and 1 attacker by myself. I have 10+ accounts

Edit: I guess what I'm trying to say is there will also be off meta ways to play the game unintentionally per the designer. How you enjoy playing it is the key.

 

I see what your saying but you can't play 6 chars at once. Therefore making the grind slow and not worth it. But if 6 different people played at once semi boss die quicker more get killed hrly and much more efficient. But you are right

 

I personally enjoy grinding. But when I get bored of the game I buy leech. But I always go back to the grind. The problem is you have people now who do not know how to grind.

On a side note if your broke now is the best time to make mage lol. Lol 30s are buying leech for 35m+

 

I once thought up a rough idea of for a complete overhaul of the exp system. Basically, party or not, your kills per minute (or maybe damage per minute? someting that measures damage or kill output) contribute to some form of exp multiplier, like a combo multiplier thats in a lot of games. And in a party, this multiplier is shared so everyone contributes to it. Bigger the party, bigger the multiplier. But this way, if you're not actually killing anything, then you're not actually receiving any exp! (which seems to be the root of the problem, you get exp in a party for doing nothing)

Encourage big parties, completely eliminate leech.

 

I thought the point of this thread was to suggest ways to encourage partying, not completely eliminate leech.

While I agree that due to low spawn rates and adjusted PQ exp rewards in new source has significantly discouraged grinding in parties, I can't help but feel like some comments/suggestions here have been brought about by salty players who:

1. Do not (but actually are too lazy to make and) own a mage to sell or self-leech

2. Cannot afford to buy leech, or

3. Cannot afford to HP wash and hence are able to grind

There have been numerous threads, comments, and extensive analysis about how HP washing, which I personally think is the main driver for the leeching economy, should be removed from the game, again by salty players who can't afford to or simply don't want to put in the required effort. My questions to these players then are:

1. Why should the game mechanics be changed to suit lazy players like you?

2. Why should players who put in the time and effort to achieve their desired HP goals (or any other goals for that matter) be undermined by players like you who just want the easy way out?
@Kaneki977 since you talked about undermining of goals, it honestly works both ways

No one said HP washing was mandatory, despite the growing popular belief in this server. In fact, one of the strongest Bowmasters in the game (I believe this would be widely acknowledged too if you knew her), hardly washed and has just above 7k hp at level 200. We have gone on countless HT runs together just fine, just that she had to take more care during main body fights and we had to adapt from the conventional strategy (order in which we kill the parts). I won't go into the details but this is absolute proof that HP washing isn't as necessary as everyone thinks, it just makes things a lot easier in the late game, and that's why players go for it anyway. Because working hard now enables them to enjoy the fruits of their labour later.

Anyway, my apologies for digressing a little, but I just had to get that part through and I hope it sticks with new players who don't want but get influenced to HP wash.

With the growing affluence of the server since new source started, it is inevitable that more and more players can afford to HP wash and buy leech, even at low levels, in anticipation for the release of HT, and in some very distant (probably idealistic) future, Pink Bean. More and more people also have multiple characters, so buying leech on one enables them to play another, which saves time and possibly provides enjoyment too. Would you choose to grind/play with 4th job skills or for an example, Power Strike for a couple of hours? I'd guess the former would apply for most of us.

This, together with the lack of working PQs, has resulted in the prevalence of low level leech. And I can understand the frustration, but all we can do currently is to be patient and wait for them to be working again. (I personally am really looking forward to the release of CPQ, as I believe many others are too.) But at this point in time, it seems like leeching, even at low levels, is unfortunately a more viable alternative to self-grinding.

Another contributor to the leeching economy is that there are players who have lives outside the game (work and school and stuff), but want to be able to reach the end-game too. Leeching allows them to save time during their working hours, and hopefully boss/grind/make money during the times they are actually able to play. Many players who complain about HP washing also cite not having the time to go through the cycle of creating a mage > training it > earning money through leech > creating an attacker. It is a definite concern since all of us only have a finite hours each day, so why look to stop others from buying leech just because you can't?

In fact, leeching might have some pros, as it presents an opportunity for:

1. A transfer of wealth from player to player
- this might only be from rich players directly to mages, but mages buy valuable skillbooks from attackers too, so there's the further wealth transfer as well (see no. 2)

2. A market for mage skillbooks
- expensive skillbooks are only expensive because they are highly sought after. Completely eliminating leech and trying to wipe mages off will severely bring down prices, and if you were a player who only has an attacker and relies heavily on bossing for mesos, would you want that? Just for comparison, Blizzard 30 skillbooks were going for maybe 100m or so in old source (please correct me if I remembered wrongly), Meteor 30s even less. With the buff for mages in new source (and lack of supply of course, but you still can't deny the popularity and demand has increased), prices have risen considerably. This is possibly a good sign for attackers since bossing could potentially bring in even more income than before right?

3. Godly equips to be found on the market
- no doubt mages are the best farming class, and they make this more possible when incentivised to farm or sell leech

To sum up, leeching is probably not the most favourable way of leveling, but it does bring its benefits and we can't simply write those off assuming other aspects of the game wouldn't completely change if leeching were to be eradicated. Instead of looking for the game to change for you, you should be changing for the game instead. And also, we have no choice but to wait till the full range of PQs come out, or for the spawn rates of more maps to be buffed, whether those maps are leech-viable or not will remain to be seen.

I know some of the points I have brought up have already been mentioned in this and other threads, and I'm sorry I can't quote each and everyone of you because I'm on my phone, but I'm just hoping to put things together more comprehensively and into perspective from my own personal observations and experiences.

To conclude, if leeching is really something you feel so strongly about, then don't buy leech! Grind your levels all the way and prove to other players that it is in fact possible to play this game and have fun doing what you joined it for in the first place. (And if it's really tough to find people to PQ with in-game, well we already have a few like-minded people on this thread alone, so maybe you guys can link up and PQ/grind together? I'm sure there are more out there too) No matter what suggestions we think of, there will be ways for others to circumvent the proposed system, and after that, we'll have all these discussions and alternatives again. When will it ever end?

Ultimately, this game is what it is to you as a player, not to anyone else. You don't have to do things you don't want to, but please don't force others to do things that you want for yourself.

Lastly, to reply directly to OP's statement about paying a bishop for door to WR, yes, you were incredibly salty that you had to, I saw your smegas that day, and no offence but I was frankly quite put off. The fact is, no one said you had to do that. If you didn't want to pay that 5m (which honestly can be earned back in a reasonable amount of time grinding at WR anyway), then all you had to do was do the JQ yourself to get there. Or you could also complete the questline that allows you to skip it. The fact that you asked for a door that day shows that you didn't want to put in the time and effort into doing that (maybe at that time, not sure if that's changed?), so yes, it's a pretty dick move to sell doors to the CWK maps (or to anywhere for that matter, map-selling was rather stupid too), but you can't deny that these players actually spent the time and effort getting to CWK in the first place. You can't expect things to be free when it makes life easier for you alone, but not for the person who's making it easier for you. That, in my personal opinion, and also to be blunt, is selfish and self-centered. (This goes out to all you up and coming bishops who go around begging and smegaing for free leech daily, offering "full HS" like it's a rare treasure, instead of going to like, himes or something)