Economy [Feedback Request] B-Coins and Tax

i think sellers would just stop accepting b coin and only accept cs/ws as payment, making the idea of b coins pointless.

it doesn't matter if i have 30 b coin, those are useless if i can't use it to buy stuff if no seller is willing to accept b coins , if anything this proposed change will encourage players to convert mesos -> cs/ws even more.

 

I think it makes perfect sense to tax the person trading away the coin because ppl accept bcoins @ 1b not 970m which at that point they’ll just buy ws/cs instead… this is looking like my paystub

If the goal was to incentivize using bcoins in trades instead of tax evading on ws/cs then the trade fee % should be lower cause it does add up if you are paying for a really expensive item

 

Is the current system no good?
I like the current’s simplicity which works just like mesos..

 

I believe the seller will find a way to tax the buyer as usual, like + 33.333.333
Tax still theft even on a game.

 

i think every seller wouldn't wanna get taxed , sure if every buyer is willing to cover tax for every seller, this would work, but it wouldn't be much different from the system we have now since the one paying by b coin has to fork out extra to cover tax.

post implementation scenario would be :
seller sells a perf rc worth 25b, and only accepts cs/ws/ OR accept b coin @970m
you tell him you only have b coins.
he tells you he only accept b coins if you cover tax for him.
you pay him 25b coin and extra 30m for every b coin.

it's more or less the same, just that players would rather convert their mesos to cs/ws for ease and availability to trade with this proposed change.

right now, if i'm lazy to convert my b coins to cs/ws, i would just tank the 900m tax . also, b coins right now is stil worth hoarding, as
currently :
1) sellers are happy to accept b coins, and most likely would prefer b coins;
2) cs/ws prices are constantly fluctuating

 

The 2 parties will always find a way to avoid being taxed in situations like these. Regardless of how you “shift the burden” to the other party, eventually the trade would still continue to involve other currencies that do not require tax such as cs/ws or value the bcoin higher/lower depending on what you do with this change.

With that being said, why trouble ourselves with this?

 

no need change, I like current B coin system.

 

I think this makes sense.

The current trading system:

• Seller covers taxes in a trade that's lower than 1B or 2B.

• Buyer covers taxes in a trade that's higher than 2B.

Meso and B Coin are the same currency thus should have the same function.

I don't think this has to do with avoiding taxes.
Players can still convert the currency to valuable assets to avoid taxes either way.

 

I would love a system where paying taxes is a choice. However, tax evasion makes you hunted by NPCs such as the nexon lady that often gives you seasonal quests.
If caught, you will have to spend X amount of time in maple prison and can't boss or do anything else during the duration of your stay in the prison.

 

I feel like everyone got so used to this system by now that changing it could be considered as overly complicating something that isn't broken.

The tax rate exists to keep the economy from overflowing with meso (basically it counters inflation) and logically players try to avoid paying taxes by using other forms of currency.

Most end-game gear and the items used to create end game gear are considered currency (eg. ATT Gear, CS, WS, Auf Mir 10%, perfect weapons) since they are what players saving up would want to acquire with their mesos.

Changing this would just cause me to have to grab my calculator more often since now I have to multiply 970m instead of seeing a B coin and knowing it's equivalent to 1B, since there's no way anyone would accept this new broken coin @1B.

 

while that is true, some sellers do account for the tax factor that they will be receiving lesser mesos when they aren't dealing with b coins, so they usually hike the price up a little, like if they want to sell apples for 8m each, instead of pricing them for 8,000,000 exactly, they would price them for 8,333,333.

Sellers don't do that when they are dealing with b coins, that's why you don't see like weird numbers like 25.75b for perf rc, etc. so it's always been buyers covering taxes.



like here, i would say WS are currently at about 470m market value, and you can see only 1 player selling WS at its market value, while the rest priced them a little higher to account for tax.

 

I think this change would be good since it streamlines the entire trading process on the server to a single, universal standard: all meso you receive is 3% less than what the initial number said.

As someone who plays generally casually and isn't particularly rich, I'd prefer being able to carry a 1b coin and knowing that said 1b coin is all I need to purchase something, as opposed to requiring to have some extra funds too and risking the possibility of me wanting to, say, buy mw20 or 10 att Facestompers and suddenly realising "oh poo I only have 50m on this character right now and can't liquidate immediately".

I think tax conscious sellers can still easily do price a increase of 30m per 1b coin if they're very concerned about the lost money. The table of 3 isn't very difficult.

 

No strong feelings on which side should be taxed, but if you do change it to the seller getting taxed, instead of adding a new broken bcoin item it should be:

- They get taxed 30m/bcoin received, until they run out of mesos
- The next bcoin is automatically sold and gives them 970m
- Future bcoins continue to tax out of that 970m, repeat this process until all coins processed.

That way they still recieve bcoins, and don't need to worry about having enough meso in inventory.

 

I put my store on fm

I sell items for months for example 1 mill

taxes

my store expires after 24 hours another 1% tax every day if I don't collect my meso in fredick

those who ask for leech service, zakum, horntail, auf, scar, targa and mon other tax

No wonder I don't earn much meso due to taxes

 

I like the current B coin system, I dont think theres a need to change

 

Im a little confused here , you state "Simply shifting the 30m per burden towards the receiving players wouldn’t work well as they would need spare mesos in order to sell items which contradicts with their desire of selling stuff to obtain mesos in the first place." but then you go on to show that the receiving player will now get a used b-coin which is going to give only 970m, so youre agreeing it wouldnt be fair to the seller yet at the same time the solution you have does exactly what you said is not good for the seller? maybe im reading it wrong here...

Personally, id like a system where if anything you tax both players (1.5% each) thus if someone wants to deal with mesos, both players will take a hit and not just one, and of course if neither wants to take a hit then they can convert their mesos into ws/cs. I just would like to see a system that is fair to both players, where it makes using mesos just as popular as ws/cs, instead we constantly see how ppl only want to accept mostly cs/ws (other items or scrolls) in order to not accept b-coins or in order to not have to cover the whole 3% tax

 

I dont think it matters what side is going to get taxed ,this just makes complications
either 1 side takes it and moves or asks to cover the tax with extra meso or something like that or avoids dealing with coins and goes with items of interest

also i think there is no client limit or i dont understand the limit in the code but also am sure ingame (GMS/KMS) had 10b then 30b cap way before they left the 32bit clients and am sure i'v also seen one of the royals devs showing that it can go way above that 2.147b so far that even the ui can't fit the 0's i think it was @yeepog

 

Because this is a pserver so I accepted that things would be different but one of the questions I always asked when I joined was:

“Why am I getting taxed for buying something that’s expensive (use of b coins)” I thought buying stuff was a good thing for the market. Why am I getting penalised for enabling trades?

The b coin on royals makes tax inconsistent. Every other trade the item seller gets taxed but if you buy something using b coins the item buyer gets taxed. If you explained the concept of B coins to anyone objective who does not play royals they would tell you the same conclusion: b coins are a tool to make the rich richer by letting them escape tax when they sell their boss loot/gear.

If someone is in desperate need of mesos and wants to sell an item worth 1b, why do we have to care about whether it contradicts the reason he’s selling stuff or whether he can afford the 30m tax or not. Go vote and sell 3 aprs. What about people who set up stores in the free market? They need mesos too which is why most of them sell stuff. Isn’t it contradictory to tax them then?

I find it unlikely that someone who owns several b worth of gears and wants to sell a 10b gear can’t afford 300m in tax. That person is probably already at the stage where earning 300m takes less than a day. (Get a mw20 split or go apq on 3 chars idk borrow and return after the trade is done)

main qualm with the b coin is that it’s inconsistent. But if the pserver rules it to exist and work then I’ll accept it. I just don’t think it should work that way.

changing how something works is not going to be well received by many since a lot of people have already gotten accustomed to it so if anything, the change has to be really foolproof or effective otherwise as many above has mentioned, people going to find ways to tax evade anyway.

As a trader this change is going to affect me negatively because I’ll have to pay the tax when I sell stuff but if it makes things consistent I really can’t complain. I shouldn’t be complaining about something I should have been taxed for anyways.

just my thought feel free to disagree I don’t make the decision in the end.