Even with registration having opened up, it looks like white scrolls are only getting higher in price these days. I believe there are two main reasons for this which are: 1. Not nearly as much people are gaching at nlc now 2. Merchants are not implemented Point #1. NLC gach is no longer what it used to be. I personally used to spend all my gach tix at NLC since it was a very good gaching spot, however what used to be a 60m and 45m profit in scg and fs manuals have now been replaced by completely useless itcg items. On the flip side, Perion and Henesys gach has gotten huge buffs and I am honestly seeing more ppl gaching over at these places than at NLC. Why is this a problem? More and more people are figuring out that there are now better places to gach at nlc, which means less supply and thus inevitably higher white scrolls prices. White scrolls are the main currency besides mesos and thus needs to have a healthy supply since if white scrolls become difficult to find, then trading in general also becomes more difficult. If i need 40 ws to buy a 21atk scg for example, that would be a nightmare with how difficult white scrolls are to get these days, even for a higher price. We may be a bit ok now since there have been alot of white scrolls in the pool from the old source and prior to people making the switch to other gach locations, but it is becoming increasingly more difficult to find white scrolls to trade with. Possible idea for a solution Remove Subani Ankh and add Black Crystal Blade to Perion Gach and bring Subani Ankh to NLC. Blade Crystal blade as proven in this thread is not OP at all and should be brought back anyways and would be a cool little thing to make Perion at least still a decent place to gach. Subani Ankh on the other hand is basically a SCG manual, so lets bring this back to where it was supposed to be and give people more incentive to choose NLC over Perion. Naricain jewels will deteriote in price with the dawn of BFuries and BWG's will become a bit less wanted when event gfa's disappear, so maybe Henesys can be left alone. Point #2 Merchants, believe it or not, have a significant impact on white scroll prices and here's why: Items in fm shops can only be purchased with mesos. This means that if there is a 900m item that someone wants to buy they will have to have 900m in mesos. If someone has 200m and 2 white scrolls they will be unable to purchase the item and thus they will have incentive to sell their white scrolls in order to buy the item that they need. This will bring more white scrolls into circulation since people wont be able to trade their white scrolls for items in the fm shops, and it will also bring a sense of urgency since items in the fm shop are available right away and can also be sold out at any time. These things combined will bring eager white scrolls sellers and thus a healthier supply of white scrolls Another thing is that sellers much prefer white scrolls in trade due to the high tax. This means that buyers also prefer to hold onto their white scrolls due to the fact that many sellers want white scrolls in the trade. With Fm shops the tax is halved and thus sellers will be more willing to sell their items for mesos. Not to mention that since FM shops are the easiest way to sell items, they will just sell their items in the fm shop instead of looking for a one on one trade for white scrolls, thus buyers wont be looking for white scrolls as much and as a result lowering the demand of white scrolls. With all that said however, I believe that bringing FM Merchants back won't be enough to ultimately keep white scrolls prices at bay unless the supply is increased at the source. So lets make NLC Gach great again
Everything you say just makes so much sense I'm beginning to wonder how you come up with these things; and why you have the time to write essays about them. +1
Thank you for the suggestions. The redistribution of iTCG items in Gachapon were done in such a way that it should have helped make Gachapon rewards more even across all towns. Each Gachapon currently has at least one 'jackpot' item worth at least 200m. Perion did receive a buff since new source with the iTCG crafting items as well as the Taru Spirit Cape. It could be that the chance to obtain a White Scroll simply needs to be increased at NLC, rather than making some slight changes to the rewards again, which could also lead to some confusion. And of course, we are working to try and get Hired Merchants up and running as soon as we can, just need to sort out a few other issues first like finishing off the remaining skill bugs - amongst other minor things.
Well, you are missing one small point here - cs prices are also going up. I would say ws/cs are 400/500 at their peak. And believe me, lots of people gach in shrine right now, so this argument is a little bit irrelevant, although is half true. What is true is that Nlc is one of the worst places to gach now in the long run, at least. Let me give an example: Random player gaches 3 weeks in nlc and 3 weeks in shrine. Let's assume our player is very unlucky and did not hit the "jackpot" on both. What did he got from shrine? Some junk, yeah, I won't hide that fact. But along with it, he may get - all kinds of hp washing dark scrolls, claw/bow/wand/other nice 30% scrolls, you get the point. If you are a new player, it's really gopd money to start. If you love taking risks like me and the OP you can even use some of these scrolls and make huge profits. I have made 30 tma shield with mostly 30% and 70% I got from shrine. Buying this shield for hp washing would cost me much more to say the least. So there is also this factor here. However, if he did not hit the same jackpot in nlc, he would get: 10% axe att Black paint brush 10% overall def You get the picture...And with please don't tell me about perfect ST and ele wands, these are so rare so if you are looking for a profit from these you better off with gaching in Kerning for a perfect sleeve/pgc. Well, at least you can go dummy on your black paint brush with the 10% axe attack you got! What an amazing profit! You are now the richest player on the server! My point is that I agree with the OP. NLC gach should be buffed. It's a horrible place to gach, perhaps the worst in the game now in the long run. We could also throw in taru totem in there instead of messing with Perion and Subani Ankh. I mean, bvm is used to be there, am I right? So I see no reason not to add it. It won't make it "op" because it already was like that on the past. Besides clean FS are ridiculously inflated right now. It could only help us all. After Subani Ankh and/or taru totem, this gach will finally become a decent place to use your tickets on. I agree on the FM merchants and stores - they would really make our economy great again. It is one of the main features in the game and it's sad to see it postponed but I guess there are things we the players don't know about.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but chaos scrolls were easily 500m right before registration, but these days it seems like getting a chaos scroll for 450m is no challenge at all. Chaos scrolls don't seem to be making any upward trend from what I can see so I believe with merchants back that chaos scrolls will fall back even more Also bvm was not from Nlc gach
Unpopular opinion here (maybe), but I'm fine with White Scrolls being harder to obtain or rarer. I say that having zero Whites or Chaos on my character so its not like I'm holding out on selling mine waiting for their price to sky rocket more. I feel like it's far too easy for people to perfect items on Royals IMO. Wouldnt mind seeing Chaos scrolls become as rare as Whites. There have been indepth discussions in the past about Chaos scrolls and their impact on Shoes, Capes and stat bloat on Royals
I feel like the the chances needs to be increased. At old source, I used to do 35 tickets run and my best was 2 ws in 35 tickets gacha and a 110 ST in another character also with 35 (both at the same time). New sourced I have done at least 5 runs of 70 tickets and I got 1 ws only. I have seen people like @Shiyui do a 400 gacha run with 1 WS prize only (Akira if you were to kindly confirm this info pls). I feel is also the same for shrine but I am not certain. I used to gacha at shrine in the old source and a few times got chaos with 35 ticket run. Now chances are to get 1 every 300 tickets? (if someone has done a 300+ run and can confirm thx)
I feel like NLC has always been the area you go to for itcg materials mostly. On top of WS/ST. Each town has something specific to them, but overall I think its important to look at something rather major with NLC and Shrine. Not necessarily the *rate* of obtaining a WS/CS, but looking at how many items are in the pool now compared to before. If NLC had, say, 90 items before and it was a .9% chance to get a WS, that would make it just under 1 in 100. But if now there's 95 items, that lowers the rate of WS unintentionally. Same goes for Shrine - the estimated average was 1 in 100 tickets you would get a CS or WS. Obviously not a guarantee but it was an average. Now I've heard of some people going 300 or 400 tickets without a single CS at Shrine. So, the amount of items should be looked at again I think. WS and CS used to always be about the same price, now theres a 150m-ish difference between them if not more (which thus leads to prices of the items they're used on inflating too)
Edited this for expansion, since I just wanted to reply to you 87 when I didn't have the time to write out a proper response. Yeah, it was a 435 ticket gach run, all at NLC, with one WS, no ST, and no ele 5. Two ele staffs 1 though. In my experience, it was about a 1% WS rate in old source, recalling gach runs that friends and I did. WS and chaos rates are definitely lower than they were in old source. I'm not basing that off of an n=1 claim where it's just my gaching experience. But talking to others and just watching item smegas from gach, it's plain to see that yes, the WS and chaos rate has gone down with new source. This is NOT good for the server. WS and chaos price stabilization is extremely important. They're nearly universally accepted currency in high meso transactions, and they USED to be very liquid, easily obtained and sold for 300m or so. With the low WS and chaos rate from gach and the resultant inflation, WS and chaos no longer have a stable price. People on forums are accepting these items at meso rates that differ from one person to the next. And converting meso into these items is difficult in the first place because of how little supply there is. People are smegaing to buy WS and chaos in game for above market price, smegaing repeatedly with higher and higher offers to finally get a seller. I've personally sold several WS for near 400m when the market valuation is 350m on the trading forum. And I've bought several chaos for 500m when the market valuation is 450m. People are buying these items for MORE than they're worth. For every WS or chaos I obtain, I'm losing about 50m of my actual money when I use those items in a transaction. It's almost impossible to buy WS or chaos for their fair market value. To Matt and John, I'm aware that decisions about the server in the end depend on you. With all due respect, you do not understand the perspective about the server as a player. I heard about staff discussions regarding refunding people items and meso from the three day rollback. The likelihood of getting a 14 att 3 slot sock or better again is close to zero. I understand as staff that do not play yourselves, it's easy to say well, that person could just make it again. But no, it's not that easy. You don't understand how rare that item was and how much it means to scroll it. It's such an absurd stroke of luck that's akin to hitting the lottery in this game. It was worth about 20b, which means getting rich in the blink of an eye when you don't have much to your name. It changes your whole experience on the server, having that much money. 20b is more or less a perfect weapon. It gets you that much closer to getting to the endgame community, where people have multiple perfect weapons, multiple 200s, high ranges that compete at the top of the damage rankings thread. And I'm saying all this because I'm trying to stress what the experience as a player is actually like. Making it harder to make perfect weapons and att gear is NOT a good idea. It takes on average 21b to scroll a perfect weapon. It takes much, much more to make a good cape, glove, and shoe. You don't know what it's like to work for that sort of money, how long it takes, how much time and effort you have to play on making it. It takes months to do that. It's not easy. You can look at all the people who have all these things and think that it's too easy to obtain these items, so it's a GOOD thing that WS and chaos are more expensive and harder to get now, but it's really not. Before, WS and chaos were stable in price, wide in circulation, and anyone at all could obtain them with the pure meso they saved up. Anyone could buy and use them as long as they put in the hours of making the meso. And as such, anyone could get to the top by being dedicated players and just socializing so they networked with other people. But as of now, it's prohibitive to make your own perfect weapon or att gear and prohibitive to engage in trades for these items. The former because of the limited supply of WS and chaos in the market and the latter because of the abnormally high prices for these items and the consistently upward trend since gach was changed with the advent of the new source. So, in conclusion, the current gach system with the lowered rates of WS and chaos is bad for both veteran and new players. WS and chaos rates from gach must be standardized so meso will again be convertible to liquid and stable assets, making gear from these items will take months instead of half a year for one item, and high meso trades will normalize with WS and chaos valuations. Look at the actual rate of WS and chaos from gach currently, and adjust for how many scrolls are available at their locations total or make WS and chaos a separate item from the scroll pool so the rate will once again return to 1% where the economy was both stable and healthy, unlike how it is now. It is my hope that changing gach will be a serious consideration in admin and staff chats, and staff members who play the game themselves will be able to express how important consistent rates of WS and chaos are to the server better than I have been able.
Happy to see ppl speaking out about the low rate (especially the admin/gm/celebrity). I remember some ppl were saying the same thing on the shoutbox and it was denied by a gm. Don't remember who that was and no offense. Spoiler: Trivial 1/90=1.11% not .9% lol
Did more than 1k ticket run in shrine... 0 chaos. I got to many int scrolls though which i used and still gave me a nice profit but still... 0 chaos? You kidding me? Not even an 155+ tma ele wamd or a 8+tma pgc. Anyway back on topic, i actually like the decrease in ws and cs. They are end game after all.
What world are you living in that perfecting an item is "far too easy"? Like an actual perfect item that isn't a 56/12 craven or something (somewhat) common like that. Making it more difficult with the decrease in WS rate from gach has raised the price from 300 ~ 310m each to ~360m each. If we're talking absolute averages here & you 10% + WS a weapon from 7 slots to 0, you will be spending an extra ~3.9b with the increase in WS price. I don't know who you think benefits from that, but I don't see why you would want WS or CS to stay the way that they are now.
The impact that chaos and white scrolls have on end game gear is another topic, the problem here is that white and chaos scrolls are considered to be main currency. With these scrolls being the currency that they are, the problem is that trading becomes more complicated and less flexible as they become rarer and higher in price
I have done 300+ run at shrine in total. Don't know exact number but it's way less than 1000, but more than 300 for sure. I would say 500 but I'm really not sure about this one so let's assume it's 500 for the sake of simplicity. Lost count at my 6th cs, and have got another CS just this week from an 8 ticket random run. I assume I got like 8 or 9 in total but again, I actually lost count. If only my chaos luck wasn't so horrible...If only. My point is, the rates are completely fine. I am not the only person who have got big amounts of ws/cs, I have seen more than enough people doing mass runs and getting tons of both ws and cs, to the point salty people started calling them out for "hacking". Just because you didn't get anything doesn't mean the rates are messed up. I had horrible runs at Kerning/NLC with like 200 or maybe more tickets and got nothing but garbage. But I understand I just had an unlucky run, that's all. It's pure luck, no more no less....
And just because one person gets multiple jackpot prizes in one doesnt mean that the rates are fine, just the same goes for the opposite. Which is why, rather than suggesting a buff in the rate, just check the amount of items total. With the addition of some new itcg items it might have skewed the rate unintentionally.
Do "jackpot prizes" not have a weighted chance of getting / not getting them? It's just basically if there are 104 items possible to be gained from a gachapon, you have a 1/104 to get a certain item? TIL
