I guess i misunderstood your post in a manner that seemed as if the issues us archmages are dealing with right now was waved off by the fact that you stated. You're right, then we arch mages can move there, but the core issue is that that would then in the end be what arch mages are for; grinding at skeles where the difference between tma between an arch mage and a bishop is so small, it doesnt really matter. All in all, we can all agree here that you dont want to make an archmage to just grind it out at skeles while there's a class that does it better than you (hs, door) and that would be it for your account. I myself have an hs mule, a level 156 i/l arch mage a hero level 126 and a cosair level 123. Petris is just kinda bad right now. And skeles is always full, or busy with people hoarding maps to sell. I cant be bothered to share a endgame grind map with a class that does it better, and having to find a map which takes ages to begin with. It's kind of all becoming one big headache to be honest. It should be fun, and it isn't right now. /rant
This got me quite curious. I went to shiyui's calculator and indeed it seems like her calculator is saying AM can 1 hit skeles but from my years of experience with my AM (although quite a few years ago -- probably when the calculator was made anyway), AM can't 1-hit skele. I suspect the calculator might have a bug that didn't take into account of 'the lack of ' elemental weakness of skele to blizzard and meteor. Of course if anyone could verify this would be great LOL
Hot take: 99% of you are using BOTH as mules for money and are salty you can't sell leech 24/7 in extremely OP maps. For years, leeching for mesos has become absolutely mandatory (which I'm glad is finally being discouraged). TC, haste, HB, SE, MW20 mules are constantly being advertised by leech sellers so multi-clienting is more of an inconvenience than anything else, which is GOOD. If you put things into perspective: Bossing: Bishops will always be better. There's no doubt about that, but only as utility. They don't gain xp from runs because they don't deal damage so if you die, that's it. You've basically wasted the entire run w/ no rewards. (Chance for) drops, splits, and xp are the reason people go bossing so the appeal of bossing is low unless you have friends as a mage. Training/Farming: Aside from Ghost Ship and Skeles, training as a Cleric/Priest/Bishop is absolute torture. You have to use magic claw until lv 70. You wait until 80 if you max shining ray first, but because HS is important, you won't max it until your late 80s or longer if you prefer other skills. I was able to just poison mist 2 maps on at Petris and level my FP to 120 pretty much instantly. Once you're able to ToT, you also have the ability to 1hit there whereas bishops need incredible funding to do it. (Back when I was 200 w/ full funding as a bishop I still couldn't 1hit the last map). Duo w/ a hero for more xp. Better yet, AM/Bishop duo for best results. Leeching: AMs have a much lower startup cost, both time and meso investment. You can 1hit every map faster than you could with a bishop. Blizz/Meteor 30 prices are a joke and to most people aren't even an obstacle. Booster lets you attack faster than bishops so it feels nicer as well. Even if you took the time to make an HS mule, it's just a mule. In fact, if you're complaining about AMs and have the mule, why not just level it to 120? Is it such a hassle for you to get it to bishop if you've already gotten through the hardest levels? If you want to leech at ToT, then just do the quests. Sure the number of people leeching will be less, but over time it'll become a norm and the ratio of players per map will be more diverse. (GOOD.) These are my experiences as a mage main who has gone through all the obstacles on this server a couple times now. My only suggestions are to either reduce MP consumption for AMs since potting so frequently is a hassle (and sometimes a risk due to MP guard) or to increase MP eater %s.
Infinity meta Tbh, infinity became at least somewhat useful, 2 mins out of 10, you get to cast spells for no cost, at its most efficent, it saves around 20% of your mana spendings. So techincally they already offer a solution for higher lvled mages, just max inifinty!
I like this. As for leveling up, I agree its kinda 'meh' as you barely kill stuff but I reckon PQ exp rewards are not bad at all. CPQ you get master chronos and that's good exp. Also, you're 100% right when it comes to 70-8X: no one wants to party with you as Hs isn't maxed and there's no fast way to gain exp. However, after these hellish levels, you can roam around popular maps looking for someone who may need HS in turn for free leech - everybody wins. Everything else you said, I won't comment on as I've already posted before on this thread.
Maybe we can give A/Ms a role in bossing team so that their income and value wouldn't rely on only the leech system. The only reason for the majority of players to choose A/Ms is their leech power, and this has been a proven effective way for A/Ms to make mesos. But in regards of this capability, as the situation is right now, Bishop has risen to be the most optimal choice with Exp boost, AoE map clear skill all packed in 1 character. Furthermore the community usually prefers the most effective way to progress their games, which would ultimately result in fewer A/M players and A/M giving up their job and turning to Bishop. On the other hand, A/Ms have almost no value in bossing team. Unless they are extremely funded to deal the amount of damage that can only hope to be on par with decently funded NL's ( it wouldn't even be ), no-one will ever let them in their team without the aid of their Guild or Alliance. Even in terms of utility, Bishop still out-performs the A/Ms. That is the reason A/Ms have always been among the few classes that can't enjoy high level contents which are full of bosses ( Zakum, Horntail, Krexel, Neo Tokyo,... ). Besides the efforts of making A/Ms viable again in the leech system, we should consider providing them tools for boss team fight, without over-buffing them to out-dps the current boss killers (DK, NL,... ) or to over-shadow Bishop's role. I have a suggestion that A/Ms should be given additional effects on their skills which enhance party's performance and debuff bosses. These effects aim towards the party's damage output and survivability. For example: F/P's Paralyze skill can debuff bosses with an effect that, instead of stunning them, makes them deal less damage to players. This debuff can increase the safety and decrease the number of pots consumed in boss run for F/P's teamate. Another example: Fire Demon can grant buff to allies it flies through, increasing damage they inflict. These changes open up an alternative choice for F/P to replace the 3rd or 4th attacker in bossing team as they provide buffs to other attackers' dps outputs, while also providing a tool for surviving boss's attacks. This, in turn, creates a role for them as an enhancer in party and brings about their bossing value. Also, the I/L can receive similar but unique additional effects to their kit, but with a twist to give each jobs certain advantages against certain bosses, situations,... Giving A/Ms a bossing role brings in many benefits. Firstly, it entices these players to take a different path from leech to make income: Selling boss services, rare skill books,... . Following this, inflation stemming from raw mesos partially reduces as these leech sellers split their time for bossing. Secondly, A/Ms gaming experience is enhanced as they are not monotonously focus on AoE leech skill anymore: varied skill builds to serve bossing purpose. Finally, A/Ms can stand in rank with DPS class to conquer high level content. But all of this is without drawbacks. Mapleroyals is loved for its nostalgic feeling. Adding all these changes just to polish A/Ms value and to balance the leech system may make players afraid of not experiencing the same old Maple's A/Ms they have known. Furthermore, it would require great staff's force to implement such changes of A/Ms' skills. Given the limited resource they have, it is nearly impossible to come true. Those are my thoughts on how to make A/Ms great again. I'm a lv 141 F/P that has just recently joined the game, but loves it for its old nostalgic feeling and welcoming community. But to a certain point, I realize I can't progress the game to higher content as F/P anymore, and I cannot always rely on the help from my Guild and Alliance. I must do a bossing oriented class to breakthrough higher boundaries, and leave my F/P behind who has no capability in boss team fight. It begs the question of unfairness among the classes in terms of general content experience. I know out there, there are extraordinary A/Ms who receive great supports from their trusty Guild and Alliance to carry them. But it's a minority. I hope that all A/Ms, even with or without the aid of our close friends, can have a chance to reach for higher content, a value which does not only lie in leech but also bossing.
The core issue with archmages in bosses is single target damage. Archmages do fine in zak arms / ht body, but provide less than half the damage of a normal class in single target contexts. This issue will continue to be exacerbated with lessened focus on ht due to Auf and inevitably Pink Bean. You can boss with friends, but even that can become imposing. Consider if you have a highly funded normal attacking class and a 16x night lord with like 400 base int. People are probably going to prefer you don't bring your 400 base int nl to every boss you run with them.
Buccs/pallys weren't designed with very good bossing abilities either, but were buffed in acknowledgement that bossing is the dominant endgame for most players. Grinding / leeching is functionally just an enabler to boss for most players. We have lots of custom content balance changes. However, I was primarily responding to Raitosu about archmages getting bossing party buffs, so I'll stop clogging the threads with my mage buff rant after this post.
Thank you for replying my post. My friends all say A/Ms can never do bosses, and they do have a point. Letting one in team would only lengthen the already painful boss run, costing more pots and causing high risk of failure. Most players have accepted the norm of certain classes being Atkers and Leechers, so they won't take a single look at A/Ms making offer to join their bossing team. But knowing that custom changes exist gives me wishful thinking about one day A/Ms can really be in bossing team.
Maybe remove the unnecessary elemental resistances on some of the higher level bosses? Even at neutral elemental weakness mages still do noticeably less single-target damage than other classes.
Mages should be really good farmers (and thus, have really good endgame farming maps) and leech-providers in the higher levels (ToT). Bishops should do good in bossing / low level leech (and skeles). Mages shouldn't be able to boss.
