In Discussion Class/Skill [Feedback Request] Skill Changes and Balancing

From what I gather this is the case with nearly every boss, though, because of the lack of mobility skills and need for repositioning and re-starting attacks after knockback. Nuance like this won't be brought up when looking at pure damage (like on target dummies or other scenarios where one won't get hit), and so I don't think is considered enough when looking at balance changes.

And even then, because we are single target attackers (can't call us supports when all of our supportive skills are bugged/don't work) it's unacceptable for us to do less single target damage than Hero, who excels in multi-target combat. Archers seem to be doing less dps in favoured conditions than warriors do in unfavoured conditions, yet are considered a single-target dps class... If this data is accurate it will boggle my mind what nothing has been done sooner.

 

yeah i belive sair has sharper drop off line, but it would be like an X, not a fell down V.
They have 117.74% damge of NL initially, not like bm has only 102.32% damage of Hero.

 

You can clearly see that only in non-existent, optimal conditions do BMs exceed Heroes in single target damage, but BMs are meant to be a single target focused class. Heroes are doing that damage to multiple targets at once, they have stance, they have armor, they have health, they also have a party buff, they have rush and monster magnet that actually work, and they are spending less on washing and are far easier to level than a BM.
Meanwhile BMs are ranged DPS, clearly their only strength is supposed to be boss damage, and yet they can't even beat Heroes on that one thing, much less everything else. And god forbid you compare BM dps to Hero on anything with multiple targets like Scarga or HT, its not even in the same universe.
There is no legitimate reason for BM to be this bad at the one thing they're supposed to be good at.

 

102% ahead of current patch hero and not pre-patch right? Hmmm, not too sure about the numbers but i'll take your word for it. Hero needs two enablers from buffs and still losing out to BMs who's just self buffing. What's unfair about that though?

I highly doubt that a warrior with equal gear strength can outdps a bm in any BM favored condition. Which favored condition do you have in mind? I assume its single target heavy so either krex, auf, toad, papu, BGA, BGB, grandpa, VL? You can argue for VL since VL spam summons, so it would make sense that a hero would have an edge over BM in that situation but i don't see it happening in the other bosses. Have you seen a hero solo papu? They spend extra 15 minutes to prepare their SE/SI mules and within the first minute their buffs get dispelled and oopsie there goes their damage! Toad summons? Warriors can't even hit those little demons! It's why hero/drk generally avoid auf, toad and zipangu bosses.

I think you are looking at class comparison with a different scope than i do, in the sense that you are using BM's personal DPS as a metric to their strength as a class whereby i'm looking at what they can do for a party. They are also one of the better classes for solo play.

To illustrate my point, how about putting it this way. In a heavily single target focused situation, which party do you think would be faster?
A) NL + BM
B) NL + HERO
C) HERO + BUCC

Or in a solo party where no external buffs are allowed, simply self buff and solo, who do you think is faster?
A) BM
B) HERO

While I agree that BMs are not the ace in any field, but do they need to be the star? They are insane party enablers (NL mostly), having the ability to turn a party from D tier to S tier simply by their inclusion. No NLs would run any content without SE and I'm always a happy drk whenever i have them in my party. BMs feeling lackluster is not because they have low damage, they don't, it is more about that the value of utilities in royals is often overlooked as they can easily be replaced by mules, and that the endgame content right now is more favored towards melee. Perhaps that might change when there's PB and newer content that is anti mule. If you feel that BMs should have more damage than they already do and play more of a central attacking role than a supportive one, more mobility and more damage, then why not just play sair because that's exactly what sairs are..

 

we could unironically have a super healthy game meta by just deleting thieves

 

As far as I recall, if I’m playing Marksman and hold down the key for the "strafe" skill (the one that fires four arrows)... ...if I hold the skill key down for too long, the character stops attacking.

It makes me wonder why they designed it that way.

Is it perhaps to detect macro-botters? When a Buccaneer (a dead class) gives us the attack speed buff, we attack so rapidly that after about three minutes

my Marksman stops attacking—it’s as if I’ve run out of arrows, yet when I check my inventory, my supply is full.

It makes me wonder why they want to nerf the Marksman; we aren't like Bowmasters, who can just hold down a button without any issues.

Sometimes, when I'm fighting Krexel, it’s frustrating when my Marksman stops attacking for a brief moment and I have to move around just to start attacking again.

 

I remember this is an "anti-stuck-key mechanism" that existed in the original game — because in the past, some people would place an eraser or some heavy object on their keyboard for hours at a time, go out or do other things, and come back to find their EXP had automatically increased. And since this isn't a script, anti-cheat measures targeting scripts are completely useless against it.
But I'm not sure why BM's Hurricane is the only exception.

 

BM’s hurricane is no exception. If we hold hurricane long enough, the hurricane bow effect is still there but no arrows come out.

 

It happens after 100 attacks in the same location (x-coordinate, maybe a couple pixels wiggle room). BM hurricane (and sair rapid fire) only count the initial shot as an attack. Probably good because otherwise they'd need to reposition every ~12s which sounds awful