As i mentioned, EXP is not simply not as valuable in comparison to mesos. Rushing to lvl200 in the year of 2021 isn't something that a player would invest in, especially its their 2nd or 3rd character. For your time investment, which rewards would you prefer mesos or EXP? The answer might differ depending on the level of gameplay. But lets be real. It's mesos. Spend an hour for the same amount of exp. Risk x4 apple for a chance at HT Chair / MW20 / Genesis 30, and probably the most attractive of them all. The HTP reloot. After 2hours of horntail, you sweep up with the non supbar exp boss, shao. Wrap up with krex and perhaps even try to R>CWKPQ You'd be tired by then. I don't even want to include Dojo, Auf, toad, and BGA for our lvl175+ friends. This grinding map will not be a competitive option in comparison to bossing. To enlighten you in the quad ulu comparison. Will you prefer to invest 1hour into grinding for exp over grinding for 150mil/h + rare drops? Ontop of that it's simply a waste of time for bishop players that can gain 180-200mil/h by selling skele leech to even be in that map, or mage mains that easily gain 160mil/h if that might be another concern. (Yes archmages, you are once again forgotten. Go back to Petris, you're just wasting MP there.) Especially after your 3-4hours of bossing gameplay. You still gotta SMEGA for 6 players before starting that content. It is.. ridiculous. Once again, my concern is if there are no changes to rewards and just an exp map. This will probably be still a dead content. Instead of slight incentives buff to the exchange system.. it needs a overhaul. Exchange shop using Purifying totem for Chaos Elixir & Tonic of Creation to tackle HP Washing issues might be something to start off with.
I dont get why so many people so are so concerned with keeping the bossing the leveling meta over grinding and hurting players who want to spend more than an hour actually playing the game. Instead of making it more gimmicky just make it better than current "diverse content" (lol) so there is a logical progression. Its already going to require a full party for full exp. Additionally for a server plagued with HP washing issues youd think people would want to make grinding more viable. Also... less people needing to boss to get half decent exp, means the items from bossing are more valuable.
Simple, would you like to boss, or would you like to grind? If you like to grind, make a bishop and sell leech. Make a archmage and farm single client at ulu1, if u wanna make more? Use 4. Far more efficient. Sorry but, this is the truth. Yet, how many players in this server hates farming and selling leech. Hmm. Oh wow, quite abit. No one really cares about exp after you reach lvl200 knowing that it aint any sort of accomplishment. Theres already far too many lvl200 players in the server, and getting there as of now is by far too easy. Even without washing. Its 2021. As usual, players would obviously choose the more efficient route. Players would rather have a perfect weapon of their choice over a lvl200 character. End game players rather spend that time grinding for a +1 slot in their auf helm over spending time trying to level their side characters that actually requires him to put in effort and find 6 other players before starting to grind less , with less efficiency than HT. Thats how it is. Sadly LHC doesn’t provide what players are looking for. Perhaps in the future, Von Leon sure. As of now, Its not much different from ToT. Just that u get bonus exp from partying up and playing a non-meta class.
What? Lol. Im talking about viable grinding EXP not income. No one should need to make a bishop and sell leech to be able to go grind????
Perhaps just a rant, after reading all these comments. Viable grinding exp.. is no longer a thing, and i simply can’t see ppl in putting in too much effort for it after awhile. Looking at LHC content its just a big sigh.
I really disagree with this point of view... for newer players without a limitless amount of gear and meso to spend and multitudes of friends to boss with and get carried by earlier in your bossing lvls, grinding is very viable and this questline is amazing exp if you can find 3+ people to grind with. As someone who loves the grind over bossing my only gripe with this new addition to the server is the time limit. There are plenty of drops and totem rewards + great EXP to make this area worth it. The only problem is people who "grind" are looking to stay for more than 1 hour a day.
My viewpoint on the game is indeed abit skewed for a player that invest so much time into minmaxing, so thats been my view on most things for quite a very long time. Loving to grind is totally alright, but don’t you wish, To be the one carrying the boss runs one day? To achieve as far as you can? I truly apologise to say this but, this isn’t the content that a player should be doing if your trying to be efficient in spending your gaming hours. Period. What I’m suggesting for this content to be improved to not only its a decent party play map, but also be financially rewarding for our players as well. This will make full use of the 1H time limit yet players will be constantly J> & R> for it. Yes, i’m at the side where i feel a 1H limit is good, but its not a 1Hour i’d even consider recommending players to invest in their daily 3-4hours of gameplay.
I think we just come from two very different perspectives, which is fine, and valuable (naturally, we are at two very different stages as players.) Thank you for clarifying, I can see many players do consider meso perhaps more valuable when grinding is considered, especially given the current bossing exp gain. I don't think I necessarily agree with how strict your model is in terms of how people go about planning their Royals' day... At this point I'd be nitpicking by addressing your points. I had hoped to address your concern with my statement: That is, like you are saying, there is room for a shop with items that are valuable to players, which in tandem with the great EXP gain, will allow them feeling like they've earned something more tangible (HP gain, untradeables, mesos) for their hour. Mesos can be tweaked through the drop system (seriously, the drops are quite lucrative in there, but the system needs some fairness balanced in) Untradeables (such as the reloots you love so dearly ) can be addressed via the release of VL, perhaps giving those players who do not wish for exp an incentive to participate, even in the grinding. I do quite like the idea of implementing HP gain into the shop as well as things of that nature. If I'm going to be honest as well, I am not a fan of exchange quests, and you are right about an "overhaul" in that direction. History has shown us pretty well that exchange quests do not fair well and usually become dead (while this is slightly different, I don't see a single soul grinding the Ellin exchange quest,) and I'd assume that if the LHC exchange was not the only purpose for totems, no one would use it. There needs to be a rework in that regard. So while I don't agree with all of your sentiment, there are some tweaks we both agree on that I feel would be beneficial. Thank you for this exchange, as it has let me think a bit more critically about the content. I don't quite understand what you're getting at by quoting my post. The system I mentioned at the end could be tailored so that even after the diminishing return, the EXP can be quite lucrative, as well as the secondary gains. My interpretation of a desirable outcome here is to have some amount of time which players will feel compelled to use to the fullest (like an hour of 100% bonus EXP), and then it's a bit more chill, but still rewarding, for those that want to play more. I don't seek to "hurt" players that want to grind more so much as I seek cautious implementation. I think there are many ideas in this thread that work towards that goal (which I am in favor of for the most part.)
It doesnt exist because every chance to make it good its kicked in the nuts to preserve the meta. Lhc would have been fine in its vanilla form, but couldnt have that. Lol
The reward pool contains highly valuable items that were previously locked behind gach. The exchange quest provides a pretty good income but prob need some minor adjustment. We added the exchange quest so even at lv200, player may still grind for meso. However, I do agree with the lack of incentive for end-game players. The exp and meso income is good but the attraction is simply not there. Endgame player don’t need the exp and simply wants to upgrade the gear even for 1 attack. The amount of meso gain doesn’t replace the feeling of getting a brand-new-hard-working item (like dojo belt).
What about non-endgame players just trying to level? Im all for making it rewarding post 200 but we need bodies in the content now and the people who need it, lets be honest, arent level 200s.
Alittle more on regards to the end game system. I sincerely wish LHC is a 2 part update where Von Leon will eventually come out so it attracts both mid game progressing players and end game min maxing players. Alittle off topic, but releasing aran and gate keeping its skillbook behind Von leon might be a decent idea. Or simply superior crystals if you plan to release it after PB. Yes, everyone know there isn’t much rewards left available in the game for such a major attraction. I just hope we don’t have to wait another 5 years for this boss where i’m already a dad or smth. I got no idea why this didn’t go through, this really showcase that royals actually needs a balance team with solid end game knowledge to balance the game. Or we’ll just be expecting more of these.. dead content updates. Back to the main topic, @Kenny whats your opinion on a exchange shop & its rewards or simply a bad idea? These level 200s are bored out of their minds, playing & donating at the server next door. You guys very clearly know which one i’m talking about. Then boom new casual & midgame content again. Wtf?
The current LHC is extremely good for non-endgame player. You may get equivalent of HT exp starting at lv130 already. We made it one hour limit so player only needs to spend one hour at LHC instead of grinding three hours at lower rate (aka your desired vanilla form) for the same result . I suggest you try it first. The exchange shop is a good idea but we like to have it more rng based. The exchange quest is like a mini gach that gives out really good items! It is worth it for endgame player grind at LHC too. It gives about the same amount of income as HT in average
Im all for more end game content, but lets not pretend lhc is midgame or casual. Its mid to late 4th job lol. Theres no reason it cant be rewarding for post 200 and still be a kickass grinding spot, god forbid.
And for all the people who cant play daily and grind a lot all at once? Shit out of luck right? Again, why cant it be good exp and unlimited time? Why is it such a problem that people dont need to boss to get good exp??
Just like Ulu1, you just win sometimes and lose sometimes ontop the of the flat NPC rate Minus finding 5 more players and 1 hour limitation.
Sure, coz we all have 4 mages to level up our mules at ulu while getting mesos, that's why we're a "leech free" server. Also everybody are able to dialy run all bosses in chain because, you know, we all can dialy play more than 4 hours. Finally found a party today and it was something different as bossing, it was fun to have 5 more people actively participating in the grind but once again, the timer... 1 guy had 30 mins on his timer and told us a few minutes before it ran out literally saying "Let me go out and back to restart my timer before i get kicked" just to realise it was 1 hour dialy only. After that dcd we kept going to help the other guys with their quest and 1 of them just left the party saying "it doesn't worth going with 5 im out". Another thing i would like to point is the active time you have to be attacking to get the bonus exp... It was going on and off while the party moved to kill in another plat, especially for our warriors and the bm, i think the 5 secs could be increased a bit (8-10 secs) and still be funtional since iirc 8 secs is the respawn time for mobs, so if you finish with a mob and cant find another one in the 8-10 secs one will just respawn besides you to keep attacking without breaking the bonus chain.
So.. at least some people have problems with: 1) The 1-hour timer, which also leads to conflicting timers. 2) The lack of participants. 3) The lack of monetary incentive for end-game players, namely Lv. 200's. Sounds like the problem might be partly stemming from a limited population spread thinly throughout various timezones too... I'm not suggesting the following is a realistic solution, but I think if there was a greater active player base, then a lot of the issues might be alleviated by the availability of full parties. With that being said, I would assume it's not very likely that the population would grow to fulfill the mentioned solution... so in that case, maybe tweak LHC so that you can efficiently grind it with smaller parties? I know we're all going for the nostalgia part, but Royals obviously isn't exactly the same as old MS in a lot of aspects - like the population count. It SAYS 1k+ players throughout the day... but how many are AFK and/or mules? Tweaking LHC in such a way for maintained efficiency even at smaller party sizes may address the lack of participants because more people might be motivated if having a full party wasn't an unspoken requirement. The 1-hour does seem kind of short, but the existence of the timer itself screws with people trying to grind without interruptions due to someone using up their time bank before others. And let's face it, people get absolutely FUMING over APQ when someone even mistakenly enters a run without realizing they don't have 4 runs... LHC is looking like it may fall into such a pattern. I assume staff worried that unlimited access to LHC might be too good of a source for grinding? If so, then maybe nerf the aspects of LHC that may be overwhelming and compensate it with other incentives? I don't know exactly what the reasoning for the timer was, but yeah... I don't believe in the timer simply because it causes so many problems for party coordination. And as previously mentioned, it's hard enough to FORM a party to begin with, let alone maintain it throughout this controversial 1-hour timer. It simply does more harm than good, IMO. Monetary incentives... well there's talks about VL, so that might address the rewards issue. If not, then maybe increased drop rates for LHC? Or custom-made, repeatable quests that are monetarily rewarding like a PQ, but not a PQ, because LHC is simply about grinding with a party. I thought the implementation of new content was simply to provide viable alternatives so that there isn't this "meta" that everyone mentions, but forked paths on the road to endgame. My personal opinion on the existence of a meta itself is that it kills in-game creativity in the sense that most people meta-slave away for maximum efficiency rather than personal preference. Some people still stay off-meta but they soon find that it just takes too much time or feels kind of lonely. Meta(s) drain(s) out most of the players from other possibilities and inevitably leads to a lack of players for new content if it simply doesn't measure up to what's already been released and I think that's what might be happening here.
