Shadower Class feedback

I personally think that pursuing a buff to pickpocket is silly. Buffing pickpocket will never be a good idea because the amount of mesos you would need to outweigh continuing your rotation of bstep>assassinate would be so large it would just become a way to farm mesos lol. I think bstep should receive something like a 400-500% increase in damage to get it up to par with similar skills in other classes. I know people will probably laugh at that suggestion, but that's what I believe is appropriate for bstep. I think assassinate is a very poorly designed skill and could be fixed pretty simply. I think the dark sight requirement should be removed from skill. I know it's a bit of a flavor killer, but the skill doesn't work if you have anything but perfect connection to the server, and ever still it can be inconsistent. Having to wait for the interaction of your client responding to the server before allowing you to cast assassinate is too clunky. I think adding a short cooldown to the skill would not only improve the skill's consistency, but also allow you to throw in something else into your skill macro instead of dark sight. the current macro looks like bstep>DS>assassinate but it could look like bstep>assassinate>savage blows(or something along those lines). Also, here's another suggestion that also solves the issue of assassinate dealing crap damage. Make the skill "charge" all the time after the cooldown of the skill is reset. This way, you get a boost of damage after being stunned in a boss fight, after a weapon cancel, or just walking between platforms while grinding. Also, seeing crit applied to all 4 hits of the skill would be greatly appreciated. I think making these changes to bstep and assassinate would make the class much better (since it's near the bottom of the tier list in DPS) and would also make the class more responsive and gratifying to play. Buffs to Smokescreen would also be great. I would like to see a 1 second increase to every level (making it 90 seconds at lvl 30) and reducing the cooldown to something like 6 or 7 minutes. I enjoy the moments when SS cooldown is done and everyone comes together for a big group attack on a boss. Making these moments longer would do wonders for the skill and also just make party members appreciate the skill more. Another thing to address is that meso explosion is still not functioning like it was in old source. Please allow for speed bombing or change the formula so it actually deals as much damage as it used to. I did 4 solos on krex using just meso explosion and it costs significantly more mesos and takes longer to complete than it did in old source. Maybe they already fixed it, but I haven't heard anything about this bug in a long long time. I'm not sure how none of these shad mains have pointed that out (FRAUDS DETECTED).

Here are some of the suggestions I've seen that also might be worth pursuing, but are much less signficant:
-Buffing party's damage while in SS
-Adding more dagger mastery (possibly adding this to the venom skill would be smart)
-Replacing Chakra with a skill that does something. Literally anything.
-Make shield mastery do something (add % or flat WA when using a shield) this improves low level play as well as making it worthwhile to level
-Make Band of Thieves do MUCH more damage (400% or 500%). this skill feels terrible to use and forces you to use ME for leveling until you get lvl 21 bstep

I kinda just see people mocking these suggestions because they are very significant, but everyone should just chill out. This game is primarily about having fun and there are a lot of things holding shadower back. I've spent more time playing shadower than any other class and I know for certain that these changes would make it way more fun and responsive to play shadower. Even with bstep doing 1000% damage, it's still gonna be trash compared to a night lord.


Here is a list of DPM per class. With Bstep buffed to 1000% and assassinate buffed to 800% per hit, we would still only be dealing about 311,280 under absolutely perfect conditions which puts us right next to Hero. I honestly think with that said, it should be enough to justify the changes.
EDIT: I feel like it's also necessary to add that this dps is just single target. I would think that a Hero hitting 2 or more targets would still out-damage a Shadower by a significant margin. Bstep is our only mobbing ability for bossing and it has a pretty significant cooldown. Additionally, I know that the staff is generally averse to large buffs (since I've never seen one this substantial happen), but even with this damage buff we would still be considered low tier for bossing and there are so few Shadowers at a bossing level that it wouldn't even shake up the meta considerably.

Please help save my favorite class.
Ironman btw

 

What can I say? Solid feedback with the data to boost? What more could you want, While I have not played a shadower on royals yet ( Tho I do plan on making one ) I was a level 175 shadower back on the old GMS so trust me, I have put my time in. Some changes I was wishing for back in the day was the following :

-Remove the Dark sight requirement from Assassinate and give it a 1 second cooldown so we can rotate it with boomerang step.
-Allow Venom Stab to apply and stack on bosses.

"-Replacing Chakra with a skill that does something. Literally anything. "

IKR? Fact fact, I played on some private server years back that replaced Charkra with a skill called " Issen " that gave the shadower a 30% critical hit chance with 200% damage and it was so much fun.

Looking forward to good changes no matter what they will be.

 

hitting with assasinate 30+ drop 5k bag in trio, 30minute-45 minute run!
but i wanna see pickpocket drop the 10 % damage in bags is a dream...
i wanna see pickpocket drop 10% damage, if i hit 40k for asesinate x 3, pickpocket drop 4k bags... and drop in the place i hit, no in mid of monster like zk,krexel etc...
sorry for my bad english.

 

Can't believe I forgot to add that I think that Bstep should stun mobs at 100% rate at lvl30. I think it's silly that a mastered skill is inconsistent like that and it makes grinding ToT a pain sometimes when you expect everything to get stunned when you use Bstep, but every once in a while there are some stragglers. Feels bad for no justifiable reason. I propose that the additional 10% should be added at lvl1 of Bstep. I think this same logic can apply to Paladin's Advanced Charge. ACB should move Charged Blow from stunning at 90% to 100% (1% more stun for each level of ACB) since it implies mastery over the skill.

 

Are these changes taking any progress soon? I am very disspointed about the current state for shadowers

 

soonTM

 

I maxed chakra for dojo. Why would they mess with a skill that has nothing to do with the 4th job issues?
Also giving shield mastery attack buff makes nooooo sense. The khanjars were one of the turing points into the entire post bb overhaul, not this servers style. We have them, and they make the reverse/timeless shield useless sadly.
Shads just need mastery and a boost to assassinate.
Bstep is just a super long range brandish with iframes.giving it mastery is moooore than enough.
Assassinate either needs a damage boost along w/ mastery, or an execution tweak. Like a base execution w/o ds, and the normal with ds command
Smoke screen getting something like 70% crit at max with sharp eyes for the party would be a nice buff, and crits meso explosion in smoke too

And fixing taunt plz

 

I know I am late to leave feedback on this thread (since I’ve been away a long time) and unsure what progress staff has made so far. But I would still like to put in a word for my fellow shadowers. I have mained shad since I started on the server like 3 years ago and find it a real shame how this is one of the classes that have been neglected considering it has such a diverse and exciting toolbox to work with hiding a lot of potential.

Also, if I am out of the loop about certain changes and fixes already done, I apologize. xd

I like a lot of the ideas thrown out so far in the thread and here is my take on a few of those:

Spoiler: Possible improvements to Shadower skills

• Bstep: I think after “new source 2017” came out there was already a reduced delay on bstep implemented. It was a good improvement, but more can be done to reduce the delay or more importantly, adding some kind of damage buff, flat % increase or something. Plus, since we can bstep off of ledges now, shadowers can finally contribute to tackling the once unreachable heads of HT on closer footing to say, heros.

• Assassinate: I would support a “speed up animation” of this move since it is much slower compared to say, brandish. I’d probably lean towards keeping dark sight animation since it suits the class’s strong evasiveness component and sneaky playstyle, but I do understand it is a part of what causes the choppiness of the move. The dark sight charge isn’t incredibly useful unless you time it correctly by charging it during Zak weapon cancel and releasing it after it passes maybe, but dropping mesos is usually a better use of the time lol.

• Meso Explosion: This skill is cursed with some unfortunate glitching/bugs happening and is risky to use, so it’s tricky to decide if something should be done to it or not until it is fixed. I do agree with @MSdrawman that it felt different after new source was released or maybe it’s just me. If it helps with balancing better to nerf ME in exchange for buffing bstep/nate, then sure. I don’t think pressing changes need to be made to it besides the fixing the glitches.

• Smokescreen: Reducing cooldown and increased duration would be nice to help with contributions to party buffs for bossing. Smokescreen isn’t really a buff for shadowers themselves and it is more for the party. Therefore, buffing smokescreen would be another aspect that could make shads a more appealing class to add to parties for bossing.

• Pickpocket: Tbh I only used it when I was training at wolf spiders, so I never saw much use for it. I remain pretty indifferent about it still.

• Taunt: Fixing this skill, of course.

Overall, emphasis on 4th job skills over ME is needed. I’d like to see ME staying as the primary skill used for Chief Bandit training (BF, HH, and Himes) instead of Shadower training (Zak, Ob4, HT, etc.). It would allow for a shad’s range to be showcased and reflected based on the merit of equips/weps over time rather than, “How much faster is my clicking since x level and/or compared to other shads?”

Also the fact that this thread is titled Chief Bandit/Shadower instead of just Shadower says a lot of what improvements can be made to emphasize those 4th job skills.

Thanks @Luna for opening discussion on this topic. I look forward to what the changes the staff will implement to hopefully improve the enjoyment of my favorite class.

 

Without saying any further, because there's alot that have already been said, my periot suggestions are:
- Change the damage curve of Meso explotion, making the rate of meso/damage ideal at 1k mesos (just like is now at 5k) but the damage at 1k would stay as it is now, so consider this a nerf for ME abuse. Reason: This is because mesos are so easy to obtain in this server, that basically this job only means is ME, a skill that doesn't even depend on range, just like someone said, no diference from a lvl 200 shadower funded to lvl 80 CB with a lvl 10 dagger. It is pointless.
- Buff the amout of mesos dropped by pickpocket, but make them unable to pick. Reason: used in combination with ME would make this both skills useful while grinding, without abusing them.
- Increase the damage of Boomerang step by 100%, also, add a pasive buff that permanently increase (at level 30) the damage of Savage Blow by 30%. Reason: balance on BS, Savage Blow is an iconic skill for Shadowers, making it worth to use with 660% damage after 4th job.
- Decrease the skill delay in boomerang step to 500ms.
- Delete dark sight requirement for Assasinate, but introduce a short cooldown for it.