The best way to calculate the actual differences to do several Tests under different circuntances and bosses(wich is gonna be quite hard, easy to try at krex and zak, but getting an equivalent hero and make a whole HT/NT bosses is something else, again paper math is less than a merely reference for jobs that have a quite tricky gamestyle. I havent seen anyone that after the drk buff tought that drks were overpowered, then actually tried to main one, and after that still thinks the same, the difference between managing to hp to a certain number, and not care at all, is not big, is HUGE, cannot even stress how big it is, even more if duo+ atacking meta keeps evolving(multiclient should ALWAYS have to be considered and the actual rate of those perf. conditions appear)
I think it's dumb that leveling a mage or Bishop beyond lvl 130 or 140 is actually counterproductive because of party exp and the current Trio Duku meta. You kinda get punished for playing those classes to fulfillment lol.
Seems alot of people just don't think mages deserve anything because of mage ult. See the aversion against even slight buffs to single target damage, when slightly improved bossing is of no quantifiable (meaning mesos / exp) improvement to mage (high level arch mages can grind 140m exp/hr or sell leech / grind equip npc for superior mesos to bossing / etc). And then when there actually mobbing portions to bosses that one may want to use arch mage at (see auf) all the mobs are immune to poison and freeze, and resist 50% ice, fire, and holy? Good thing they can be webbed and stunned though .
I know it’s been said a few times in this thread already, but I just wanted to restate that sairs are not in need of any sort of major buff. I do like the idea of a more instantaneous remount on ship however, not for the sake of DPS, but rather a more fluid-feeling play style.
Yeah honestly wtf, not a single person replied to my arch post, page four in this very thread https://royals.ms/forum/posts/1096304/ -- literally nobody cares about arch mages. Why are we ok with this leeching/mule shit, it's so bizarre and boring. Ultis are fairly bad in bosses, and arches have no 1v1 edge, just close the 1v1 gap, nobody is suggesting arches blow BM/MM away and even if the gap is closed, there's still the party meta, nobody is bringing arches along except for fun... remember fun? that's the point. Why is everything so toxic, not balancing them and giving them the option to participate at all reinforces the leeching/farming/washing/top100 economy meta, like who gives a shit. It would be cool too if you can't find any buyers to go out on some boss runs, you'd think, but, as it was recently mentioned, it's counterproductive for arches to level over 140. So since that isn't fixed or rounded, that also reinforces the washing/leeching/top100 nonsense even more. Nobody is gonna stop washing chars or doing gacha runs, the economy will be just fine with or without farmers, since about 150b is generated every day just from ws/cs alone The mention of mages helping paladins? No, I disagree. You'd need the right one first of all for the right boss, and this is the absolute wrong way to approach arches, to be paladin mules. That's not fun at all either. Buff their passives, buff I/F demon, have big bang push mobs at a rate lower than the NL skill, have demon give a boss only bullseye effect that boosts paralyze and CL, have infinity be a party skill that gives everyone unlimited mana, buffs all m.att and increase all magic attacking skills, ignore m. cancel, or give a m. crit, it's only 40 seconds at max per 10 minutes. let them have fun like jeeesh. Nobody is saying make mages stronger than any other class, but don't take them completely off the table. If some arches want to krex, they should be able to. If three or 4 want to shao, they should, everybody else gets to, it's fun Same for bossing with PA or 2hbw, no reasons these aren't viable options for players (suggestions for both PA and 2hbw in this thread) https://royals.ms/forum/threads/general-warrior-feedback-useless-skills.160831/ Or put a cooldown on the ultis. Don't care who this insults, if the ultis are what break the mages and carve out this bizarre culture, then nerf the ultis and buff the other skills so players don't just make arches just to camp maps and leech, there's no party play in that at all, it's a problem, really. Just give players 100-120 more party content or incentive. If leeching is an option, people don't even want to play the game. However it works for the server because so many classes have to wash for different reasons if they want to enjoy late game, so of course the toxic leech culture thrives, instead of just making slightly more HP available and bosses slightly more difficult... ...
So if zerk can't be modified, then maybe they shpuld just offload some of this damage buff to another skill. For example, nerf zerk extra damage to 160%, and add to archilies or eye of the beholder 40% damage at max level. Because the tough bosses that make zerking impossible are on the higher levels, pushing the damage to another skill would allow for having a bit more damage even at full hp. The downside is a nerf in damage to lower lvl drks, until they can max that other skill.
Warriors: [-] Hero - [2nd job] Rage is undispellable - [3rd job] Armor Crash has same AoE range as Attack Crash - [3rd/4th job] CA/ACA is undispellable - [3rd job] Combo Attack can activate sigils in Cwkpq - [3rd job] Coma increased range & AoE range - [3rd job] Panic increased range {suggestion} Make Coma/Panic no longer consumes orbs (or chance to recover 2~3 orbs) and now has a 5~10 second cooldown between skill use - [3rd job] Shout more AoE range, slightly more dmg, and hit up to 10 mobs (why: to help kill mobs in APQ stage 3) - [4th job] Enrage is undispellable [-] Paladin: - [4th job] Blast change from 1-line and becomes 2-line (split into one strong line, one weak line) - [2nd job] Threaten reworked into a AoE that deals 0 damage to (10~15) mobs in an area and causes them to have increased speed but reduced defense & attack. Now has a cooldown and scales down to 20 seconds at max. Thieves: [-] Rogue - [1st job] Double stab buffed from 130% -> 160%; slightly more range Pirates: [-] Pirate - [1st job] Dash now split into Passive + Active. Dashing now only gives +15 speed and 5 jump on active but passively gives +15 speed and 5 jump (total +30 speed +10 jump while Dash is in use) at max rank. [-] Corsair - [2nd job] Grenade throws at max range. Can now be used with Fire Capsule for slightly more damage - [3rd job] Burst Fire shoots slightly faster - [4th job] Bull's Eye Pre-requisite changed from Homing Beacon Lv. 30 -> Homing Beacon Lv. 15
I totally respect your views and opinions and don't want to come off as attacking your views. I'm personally a bishop main and I would love to have a slightly higher DPS rate myself, so I can be of more help in bosses, as a funded bishop. However, the idea of putting a cooldown on ulti's for mages would, in my opinion, deface the server. The entire point of why big bang changed Maplestory in the first place, was with the addition of cooldowns to mage ults, removing the leech meta, raising exp values of monsters, and much much more. Adding cooldowns to mage ults on MapleRoyals should be an absolute never, but maybe that's just me. Edit: I want to clarify that I don't believe that the leeching meta should be the ONLY meta, but the devs have already put in a lot of work into other areas of the game to help players have more options on their leveling path, like Ellin Forest, and even Neo Tokyo. If someone wants to do something IRL and put mesos into the economy by paying someone who is happy/willing to leech, I don't think that's an issue, as long as it's not the ONLY way someone can effectively level up.
Rework Buccaneers Here are some suggestions: 1. Backspin Blow + Corkscrew Blow increase to 6 mobs 2. Energy charge (faster charge and make duration longer) 3. Cooldown on transformation 4. Lessen the delay b/w barrage, dragon strike and demolition 5. Better defense on the energy charge (reduces touch damage) 6. Range increase for barrage *Buccaneers have lost its identity with no cooldown timer on transformation
I understand and it was the very last suggestion I made, I would much rather all the other interesting arch mage suggestions come about instead
I'm fine with all these, except threaten becomes a 2nd job chargless, aoe monster magnet, and would work a bit toooo well with HH. I think threaten should just have a more significant armor/acc reduction (like -70), and/or: -work on bosses at a reduced rate + chance -lower the duration -cost a lot more mp -*slightly* increase the elemental charge dmg multiplier to threatened non-boss monsters -increases damage of final attack -lowers KB threshold by 10%, or ignores kb threshold at 20% -also lowers m.def -slight increase in damage vs threatened monsters weak to poison and heal (elements paladins don't have). -or slight increase in damage to neutral mobs -deaggros mobs (makes them not target you/party members). a defensive tech also I disagree about panic/coma not consuming orbs, but I do agree they shouldn't be obsolete. maybe let them hit through weapon cancel? •have panic inflict darkness, like it used to lol, and have it only work bosses with max ACA, 10 orbs and give them something like -15/20% accuracy for like 10 seconds only the user gets the benefit of reduced acc, not the party. •coma, with max ACA and 10 orbs, has mp eater effect? chance to briefly lower/ignore w.def? 10 second window. 100% crit? •both have a chance to ignore weapon cancel 50% etc., effects that are short and promote reuse. also here is my suggestion from my warrior thread about rage/enrage
In reference to Panic and Coma, along with Double stab: I don't think increasing the range on these skills is entirely possible, due to them using the basic attacks as their animations. These animations, and the range related to them, is hard-coded into the client and is unable to be changed at this time. The shout change I would absolutely love, considering it has such weird range with its really far downward range, but almost no upward or horizontal range. If it hit 10 mobs that would make stunning large groups much easier, keeping flying enemies down and helps against mobs that have stun abilities. I totally agree with your suggestion to increase the range on armor crash, considering it doesn't seem to work during zak's arm phase at all. The one main change I'd love to see for heroes in general relates to enrage. Currently afaik, it doesn't even generate orbs when active so it's like attacking with no orbs and an energizer on. Absolutely worthless. If it could somehow be made to stack with other buffs, and let orbs generate while active, that would be amazing.
False, you can generate orbs just fine with it active, it just uses all the orbs you currently have to activate. But I do agree with the sentiment that Enrage isn't particularly useful in any serious bossing capacity. Maybe the +damage% you gain from maxing out advanced combo attack could be transferred to Enrage instead, or something like that idk. I discussed it in a different thread, but I'll mention my idea of how to rework Combo Attack here as well: I'm a dumb dumb, I mentioned it in this very thread, but who cares, I'll mention it again Basically the idea is, when you unlock Advanced Combo Attack at 4th job, you no longer need to build up your orbs to gain the additional damage for all skills, so as long as the Combo Attack buff is active, you will gain the damage bonus as if you max orbs, regardless of the number of orbs you actually have. Keep in mind, the number orbs will still affect the damage for Coma and Panic though. This will do 2 things: 1) Make it so you don't lose out on as much damage when dispelled since all you'd need to do is recast CA to be back at optimal damage 2) It'll allow Heroes to use their Panic and Coma skills without being punished in dps, allowing said skills to be relevant again and make it so Heroes playstyle is more than just holding down brandish. I don't think the range of Panic and Coma need to be changed, as long as they're made relevant again. I do agree with things like crash and shout having their range increased, just a good QoL change imo. Also, as I said above, I wouldn't mind if the extra damage from ACA is given to enrage instead, cuz otherwise it's a fairly underwhelming skill. EDIT: Probably would want to make Enrage non-dispelable if those changes were made to it
lol absolutely wild the posts I put sincere feedback/alt suggestions out there for discussion, crickets. Lol but post a rant that squishes summarized feedback and sweeping server criticism all into one and that gets attention. I guess it does show where folks concerns are though so that's interesting. I do hope we see boss arch independence and autonomy outside of their clearly contained leech roles someday. Even by elemental restrictions alone they can't boss, not to mention their awful 1v1. They deserve active bossing roles like any other class
Dude that's just cuz your suggestions are good and valid, so mostly we read it, like it, then continue on. I'm VERY sure GMs read it and write that input down for discussion. You're mage suggestions are really good. And some testing on how mages currently work on bosses should be done, so data can be gathered to better calculate how to buff them. There's just no knowledge or data out there. I been working on some strategies and theories how a party with mages could be used in a boss run in their current state, just gotta find the mages to bring to a boss run.
I appreciate that! I'm just trying to generate some starting concepts to work or rethink things from. I try to be very mindful of being fair and balanced, nothing op, and things that feel natural for the class, or improving on already existing concepts that maybe could be played around with, while keeping the vibe of the class true. I've made... A lot of class feedback posts and threads lol
I completely agree on every change you've listed. Also it is very sad how archers cant even be considered attackers... mules is all I've been seeing lately. A single target ranged dps class that hits nearly the same as AoE cleave melee classes... The dismount delay reduce only adds more playability to the class which is a fine change, dosent touch damage and I can relate it to the Assassinate changes made for playability ofcourse.
Top it off with a small hp/reset/level gain and not being able to use level up AP to wash........ Why would anyone (balance, fairness) wise want to main an archer when they can play a NL or a cheap(HP) melee class that outperforms them in every way (stance/shifter/cheapHP/Cleave/i-frames/exclusive projectiles) As for BM having hurricane, this game is easy af except for corsairs and drks... so why even talk about a class's playability/difficulty, you get choices for a reason. Also NL's have it WAY chiller at bosses like HT due to high avoid and ALSO heroes with stance brandish range so any argument about the way hurricane works is ill natured or probably never mained played a BM. have fun repositioning yourself every 2 seconds not wanting to fall, (corsair mains can relate to this 100%). Give me one reason to keep maining MM/BM after Lv.200 instead of switching to NL/Bucc (only logical reason is passion for your favorite class) because balance wise i wouldve bandwagoned to bucc or played NLstory, this is all I have to contribute.... but hey some still say bowmaster is broken AF or its BMstory after all
Very unpopular opinion here but hurricane or rapid fire really shouldn't be allowed to just be keydowned and fire infinitely, and the hiding spot in krex needs to be fixed, it's unsporting (so is keydown hurricane and watching Netflix) Been in countless parties where the bm or NL go afk because they forget they're playing a game because it's so easy at some bosses for them (mostly krex, then zak)
