@Tect I havent tested using d/arrows w/o soul arrow: Hurricane fires 8.33 arrows/second so a set would last relatively nothing
Fun fact: Soul arrow doesnt give u any att boost from the arrow even if ur range is using the arrow att buff
Considering the changes made since the OP was made (i.e, strafe buff and mastery buff to mm), i feel like this is a bit of a necro post, (especially when there's an active class balance thread that is better fitting for this conversation) @Sen @Dave Deviluke can you consider locking this thread?
I've def said it before but I do agree that archers simply having some more natural avoid (not necessarily a shifter skill) would give them a nice natural dpm boost. Wouldn't this game just make so much more sense for range/melee if you took less damage the farther away you were from a monster, magic or phys? Lol that would instantly fix all class HP problems while the game would stay exactly as difficult as it already is, with some new mobile boss challenges, and pinning pressure
Yeah although it would be a very innovative mechanic to apply. Basically my anchored point would be that Archers as a ranged DPS class are very lackluster in terms of "DPS" and still have to go through the painful process of funding a ranged dps class. Previously SE would have been a reason to keep them shorthanded but nowadays SE is everywhere and easily accessible.. so archers being inferior to their thief/pirate counterpart seems really unfair
Its why I've made tons and tons of suggestions that round out and fill in their lesser used 3rd and 4th job skills. Promoting lesser used skills integrated into a broader attack rotation makes the effort worth players investment, instead of throwaway sp dumps. Yes you would need a slightly different build, and be more engaged, or a higher level, but it would pay off if you did it. SE is a potent skill. Rounding out and slightly buffing preexisting skills in a way that causes you to need to rebuff them often etc, instead of just hold down hurricane, to have more payoff would make them worth it. And more natural avoid alone would do this just based on less repositioning Unfortunately we have a single arbitrary developer here so anything more complex than "buff [skill name] 2.3% (and here is my seven page statistical analysis I did for free for the staff as to why that I had to argue with 20 other people about for four months)" will be totally ignored. I just prefer less direct damage buffs, and more indirect buffs to lots of skills (including something as simple as more avoid) to overall build upon the existing styles and functions of the class. Its more fun overall and gives classes more identity
Would be nice to revive this thread or have a simple Yes/No as an answer to the archer class balance issues
There is literally no reason other than love for the class to main an archer which is a ranged dpser in 2021. (From a balance perspective)
Marksman is very strong multitarget and is very sought after at LHC, BM is top 4 single target DPS after Sair, NL, Bucc. BM multitarget is very underrated with Inferno/Arrow Bomb/Arrow Rain + SI at places like LHC and Zak. SE is still one of the best party buffs. I think archers are fine. Change the class meta by releasing different content, not by straight buffs where not applicable.
Warriors cleave (they can hit 3x more targets than archers), have power stance, cheap HP gain and they deal almost same single target DPS as archers on KREXEL (the dps tests were made on krexel 2nd eye obv) Are they really fine? Its 2021 people sharp eyes is everywhere theres more archer mules than actual players. You have to realize DPS includes avoidability/stance/cleave on important bosses and thats where archers... for lack of a better word SUCK
Not sure if it's worth it to follow this discussion if you won't acknowledge any of the points I made. If you want to ignore content like LHC, skills like Piercing Arrow, Inferno/Arrow Bomb/Arrow Rain, and other DPS optimizations that archer mains are doing on the other [REDACTED] server, fine. If you want serious avoidability pop an Amorian Basket, or make a thief class. Stutter step hurricane to reposition, momentum canceling, partying with Shadowers for smokescreen, there's a lot you can do to optimize DPS. Not sure where you're getting your DPS info from but it's laughable if you think Warrior single target is as good as archer at Krex(Pally comes closer than Hero/DrK sure), but I can refer you to @Geyforlife 's DPS calculator if you are interested. I promise you parties would love active BM/MM over SE mule. It's okay for classes to positives and negatives in different aspects.
sounds perfect to me for a nostalgy-based server. Leave it like that! Also this class got +10 att, being a support class, so to me this sounds quite ridiculous.
Let me just quick rundown Auf Expedition and how BM shines there now. Royal Guard - can stand on platform and not get hit as long as melee & higher DPS take aggro on bottom. Core Blaze - can summon Silver Hawk (3rd job summon) to cc/stun the dangerous af Mavericks that can shoot you into CB. Can also use Arrow Bomb in same fashion. Auf - Hamstring is stupid useful in managing and pinning Auf & clones (with bucc/warrior). BM also have highest (literal) range, more than NL, and now with being able to shoot in the air in Auf, they are ridiculously safe too, even during left sed. They may not as have as avoid as NLs, but they still have decently high avoid cause of their base DEX - combined with their range, they are still much safer to play than melee classes in Auf. "Its 2021 people sharp eyes is everywhere theres more archer mules than actual players" There's also a ton of weak NLs everywhere who think just because of their class, they are strong, which is hugely false. On the contrary, there are also ridiculously strong BMs, but are often overlooked and rare to find because it's not meta. I'd rather take a strong BM that can utilize their kit, than a meta-following inexperienced NL anyday.
Would people rather take a strong BM or a strong NL? im just curious cause i dont boss anymore so i dont know the specifics.
With the recent 6 att buff to BM, archers are actually doing good dps now, not that it was bad to begin with. But the qol reductions were compromised because of it. I think archers still do more dmg to warriors. I nvr got whited by a warrior at krex though my gear could have been better so i cant say for sure. If anything, I only get whited by NLs who are lower level than me and with lousier gear than me so the debate should not be between warriors and bm
